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Post by als01seville on Dec 26, 2009 1:52:11 GMT -5
Hi Trikers, Here is where you can get different size Rear Tires for your Trikes. They are the Racer Type Tires that you currently have on them now. I think all of the Trikes come with 18x10-10 except for the Chopper. I think I will try the 22x10-10 and forget about getting 12" rims. The 22 will add 4 inches to the diameter and should be good for a few more miles per hour:) www.atvtireexpress.com/racer.htmlAnybody know how to calulate the gain in speed with 22" Diameter Tire Verses 18" Diameter Tires? Alleyoop
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Post by wolfhound on Dec 26, 2009 7:43:02 GMT -5
Hi, Alley Oop: I thought the increase in speed would come from the circumference of the tire, not the width. If you can gain mph from the width then I would be interested in knowing myself what the speed gain would be. Without looking at my rear tires I would think that the wider tire would require you to find some way to avoid rubbing on the fender braces. I am spending today on doing some battery ground work on my 150 and trying out your reverse cable info. Also, weather permitting, want to apply the dyna beads for tire balancing.
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Post by powerride on Dec 26, 2009 10:55:14 GMT -5
Wolf, width is not the dif here its diameter that will increase speed. But how much ? hows the dyna beads working out ??
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Post by wolfhound on Dec 26, 2009 11:24:29 GMT -5
OK, Powerride, I can picture it in my mind now. I will wait on Alley Oop to try it, if he gets a speed increase than I will abandon my 14" rim idea and try his on the 10". Moving slow this weekend. Have to correct a bad battery ground on the 150. adjust the reverse cable on the trike to see if it will correct the shudddering in forward and then get to work on the dyna beads. Hope to get that done today or tomorrow.
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Post by powerride on Dec 26, 2009 13:11:03 GMT -5
Maybe i should try dyna beads in my Pegasus front tire. I am using some stick on wheel weights now but still get some wobble..
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Post by als01seville on Dec 26, 2009 18:48:25 GMT -5
Hi Troops, Here how the tire numbers work. 18x10-10, the 18 is the number of inches in HEIGHT from the top to bottom of the tire, X10= the width measuring across the Threads, the -10 is the rim size.
So getting a 22" height tire and the same width 10" and the same rim size -10 you don't have to get a bigger rim and different 12" tires. I do reliaze that NEW Fender Brackets will have to be fabricated to fit over the taller tires and welded on the brackets.
So if any one runs across a chart of Tire size to speed Calculator let me know. Or if someone on the forum is a math genius and knows how to do the math that would work as well. Alleyoop
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Post by zugzug on Dec 26, 2009 19:33:38 GMT -5
Im not a math wiz by any means, but the tire difference 4" divided by 18 is .22. So a 22% increase in speed with the 22 over the 18 tires. Or you can do 22 divided by 18 and it gives ya 1.22 which means that you will be doing 122% of what the 18" is doing. Same numbers...
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Post by zugzug on Dec 26, 2009 19:35:57 GMT -5
So if your top speed is 55 x 1.22 is now a top speed of 67 mph. Well if the 150cc actually has enough ummph to do it. Seems like a big step up. Too bad they dont have something in the middle like a 20x10-10 Edit: This is the only 20x10-10 I could find with a street type tread. www.redcatonline.com/20x1010-duro-di2020-atv-tire-p-12556.html
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Post by als01seville on Dec 26, 2009 21:34:32 GMT -5
Hi Zugzug, Well even If the larger tires gain 5mph thats a lot. Now why do you say 20x10-10 rather than the 22x10-10? Alleyoop
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Post by WildMan on Dec 26, 2009 23:49:10 GMT -5
Hay zugzug I really like that tread style, but is it a DOT rated tire?
David Sr.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 0:01:39 GMT -5
Dwild62, I am going to call them on Monday and talk to them. What is it Speed rated at etc.. Ours are Speed rated up to 93 miles per hour. Here is another site, cheap and dot approved. www.minichopperssocal.com/DOT-2.htmlAlleyoop Alleyoop
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Post by zugzug on Dec 27, 2009 8:59:52 GMT -5
Hi Zugzug, Well even If the larger tires gain 5mph thats a lot. Now why do you say 20x10-10 rather than the 22x10-10? Alleyoop The 22" is going to give you a 22% increase. The 20" will be 11% increase. Just figured the 22 would give ya too much of a increase considering the weight of the trike. Plus the wind drag due to the increased angle of the scoot and the 60+ mph speed.
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Post by zugzug on Dec 27, 2009 9:02:46 GMT -5
Hay zugzug I really like that tread style, but is it a DOT rated tire? David Sr. I have no idea. I was just doing seaches and thats the only one I could find with a street tread design in that tire size.
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Post by wolfhound on Dec 27, 2009 10:02:01 GMT -5
Alley Oop, the fender brackets are a minor problem. Just cut the existing bracket in two and increses the height accordingly with some sort of bar stock and paint accordingly. The same idea that I had in considering going to the chopper 14" rim. This is the way to go if the figs are right and the speed increase would be that much. Easier and cheaper than my idea. And I have a good welder available to do the work once I get the rear end gear problem worked out.
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Post by zugzug on Dec 27, 2009 12:40:57 GMT -5
YOur just trying to get a little more top speed right? Any chance you can just change one of the sprockets? The sprocket will probably be cheaper than 2 new tires. Plus the 18" are $35 cheaper a pair when it comes time to replace them again.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 16:15:49 GMT -5
ZugZug, Yea, changing the front drive sprocket would also give you some gains, but to gain say 5 more mph you would need a lot more teeth like 5 and you pay more at takeoff with that many teeth added. Also a longer chain would be required. Alleyoop
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Post by mountainmoped on Dec 27, 2009 19:56:09 GMT -5
One tooth on the front would give a considerable gain in top speed. We can pick up 10 mph by adding one tooth to to the front sprocket on a modified Tomos moped engine. Where would you get that sprocket?? I doubt Walmart would have one--Daniel could measure the stock sprocket and calculate the design for one with one more tooth. Once the design was finalized, his 3 axis CNC mill could churn them out. Wolf has seen some of the Tomos moped sprockets Daniel has made for me.
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Post by WildMan on Dec 27, 2009 20:17:59 GMT -5
mountainmoped That sounds like a great idea!! The front sprocket slides onto a splined shaft, the rear sprocket is a bolt on.. I haven't counted the teeth but the stock setup might be 1:1 ratio.. There's enough of us now w/ trikes, if we all jump in it what keep the cost down..
Keep us posted
David Sr.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 20:33:15 GMT -5
Mountainmoped, That is not true, One tooth added to the front sprocket on ANY moped will not give you 10mph. I had a moped last year and I was going to get the Tomos Revival TS. I belonged to the Tomos community forum. And the most any one got was like five miles but also going down at the rear sprocket as well. But then going down on the rear sprocket you would lose a lot of takeoff speed. I had the chart of what gains changing the front sprocket and also changing the rear sprocket. Not one combination would give you 10mph gains.
Also the front sprocket you could only put a #27 one tooth greater than what it comes with because a bigger Sprocket will not fit, unless you start to take some casing away. Alleyoop
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Post by zugzug on Dec 27, 2009 20:34:07 GMT -5
Going by the pics in the other tread it looks like the rear is a 30 tooth. The front is hard to tell but I think its also a 30.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 20:45:36 GMT -5
Hi ZugZug, Well to get speed you have to go More Teeth on the Front Sprocket and if you have room you can also go down on the Rear Sprocket to get more. Just think of it as your CVT BELT same thing. Belt climbs high on the Variator(more teeth), and in the Rear Clutch Pully Belt goes down (less teeth) top speed.
I have been looking for sprockets and found some but Need to count the current teeth and size of the shaft and the right kind of sprocket. Alleyoop Alleyoop
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Post by wolfhound on Dec 27, 2009 21:51:34 GMT -5
I can vouch for Daniels work. He is a master machinist and all round good guy. He has made one for my Tomos Revival (modded to 70cc) but we have not had time to install it. I will lose a tad of top speed on this one(rear sprocket) but will get better pulling power which, as M Stewart would say is a good thing, especially in the mountains of NGA.
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Post by mountainmoped on Dec 27, 2009 22:22:35 GMT -5
als01seville, I stated I got about a 10 mph gain adding one tooth to the front sprocket of a modified engine, not a stock engine. My wife's old Tomos ST has a custom made 30 tooth front sprocket that did require some work on the magneto cover. I bet my wife's Tomos moped will outrun any Icebear trike and am willing to bet $1,000.00. Wolf--you want to race me for $1,000.00 tomorrow? ? I will talk to Daniel and see if he is willing to make us a few sprockets.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 22:24:06 GMT -5
Hi Wolfhound, I am not doubting Daniels work as a master machinist and am sure he is a great guy. All I responded to was his statement that going one more tooth on the front sprocket would give you a gain of 10mph. I had mopeds and also was a forum member of the Tomos Comunnity Forum. And some had the Revival , Sprint, Streetmate etc..and with NO MODS to the 49.5 engine the most anybody got was 5mph, sprocket changes, pipes, etc.. Now of course if you mod the engine thats a different story, more rpms higher speeds. Alleyoop
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Post by mountainmoped on Dec 27, 2009 22:28:04 GMT -5
als01seville,
I'll try to get some sprockets made so we can try them. Daniel usually makes them during down time at work so they don't cost us anything.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 22:28:52 GMT -5
Dwild62, Here is a 21x10-10 that is not so expensive. The one you like with the threads are 94.00 apiece(OUCH). I first want to find something reasonable in price and maybe not the best tire to try them out. Then if I like the results get better quality tires. I found 21x10-10 tires for Racing & Asphalt : Click on the word Picture to see the threads on the tire: Alleyoop www.tiresunlimited.com/images/duro/DI2014TF.jpg
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Post by WildMan on Dec 27, 2009 23:23:44 GMT -5
Alleyoop Ya, but are the DOT Rated??
David Sr.
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Post by als01seville on Dec 27, 2009 23:41:40 GMT -5
Dwild62, And what will happen if they are NOT DOT approved. Alleyoop
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Post by WildMan on Dec 28, 2009 0:57:22 GMT -5
Alleyoop NOT KNOW!! Get a ticket? Not pass next inspection? Blow a tire & do a few somersaults at 60 mph, bust your head, shatter a few needed bones, so we can add more hardware to our skeletal structures & take a few more drug, or worst yet met the Devil himself? I don't know, just would be nice to know that I'm considering rubber that say it's safe to put under the seat of my pants at 60 mph.. Guess it's just the idea of it..
David Sr.
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Post by wolfhound on Dec 28, 2009 6:36:56 GMT -5
Bryan, I will race you but I get to choose which of my scoots I can use, like say the 250 Tank!! Guys, I owned Bryans wifes green machine for a brief period before I traded it back to him for my Tomos Revival. It was too hot a bike for me. It would do wheelies in a heartbeat and I never did run it to top speed but if memory serves me I did GPS it at 50 once. Too fast for me on a 110 lb bike.!!!!!! 8^) As for adding teeth to the trike sprockets my feeling is that first you need to attack the frummy differential linkage problem that a lot of us seem to be having. I hope that i will get the 'thumpers' out of my "rabbit" trike in forward gear. this week. I am also waiting to hear what Quan has to say about the problem that IB seems to know exists. I am beginning to think that IB rushed these trikes to market without doing more R&D on the trannies or just did not demand better quality control from the manufacturer. JMO
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