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Post by karl55 on Jul 3, 2008 20:50:06 GMT -5
I bought a new vog 260 and very unhappy with the product!!! to many problems to get it running!!! I want my money back I will pay the $129.00 shipping cost to return the product as stated by mike.... The scooter is so bad I am will be willing to cover shipping cost of the product and return to scootertronics. I have no problem using their shipping company they were very good and did a great job. I do have a problem with a product with what they are trying to sale the vog 260 major problem with the front end. A metal to metal sound when riding this product and scootertronics has not correction it time to refund my money.. Most everyone that has this scooter is trying to figure out how to correct the problem but that is not what I paid for. I want a scooter that I can do the PDI and enjoy riding....Let see how scootertronics handles a unhappy customer...I hope this works out for both scootertronics and the customer..I will keep everyone updated!!!
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Post by allworld on Jul 3, 2008 21:26:53 GMT -5
Hello karl55: Good Luck with this. Have you talked with Scootronics for an exchange, of a different scooter model/brand. They sell a variety of scooters, try to turn it into a sweeter deal than a cash refund.
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Post by czechmate on Jul 3, 2008 21:40:02 GMT -5
karl55, The front fork knocking is a known problem of Vogs but many people simply ignore it and ride the scooter anyway. You're saying "The scooter is so bad...," Are you experiencing more problems? Are you unable to start the scooter and ride? I'm just wondering. There is many Vog owners happy with the scooter. After all it's a Chinese scooter and you get what you pay for. Nik
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Post by shark on Jul 3, 2008 22:16:09 GMT -5
My Vog knocks, but I think it is a great scooter. It runs like a top. Is great on gas. From what I read and observe it seems most of the scooters that have the most problems are the ones that are over PDI'd and modified. It's like things get disturbed that would normaly be left alone. It seems the more people mess with them the more issues they have. I think Jacine preaches the "leave it alone" method!! Worked for me!!!
Mine has been flawless other than a little noise. Mike at Scootertronics did me right on mine. I had some pretty ugly shipping damage. He made it right. with me. He is a stand up guy.
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Post by scooterjake on Jul 3, 2008 22:46:00 GMT -5
I thought the knocking problem of the front forks on the VOGs was insufficient oil in the forks. Mike gave me the impression that this was not a difficult problem to fix. Is this true? Are there problems with adding the correct amount of oil and if done properly, will this fix the problem?
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Post by karl55 on Jul 3, 2008 22:47:29 GMT -5
Bottom line is I have a scooter that is junk and the fact that it is chinese or comes form any other country makes me no difference, when I paid my hard earned money and I can't ride the scooter I see it as junk. Yes I have more problems than the front fork, but the front fork should ring a bell and say something is wrong with this scooter. If it was an american car it would be on recall by now... I guess the chinese are special and don't fall in the laws as any other manufacture in the US. Is this front fork going to fail? You guys are on a two wheeled vehicle and if that front fork fails then you are either dead or in the hospital I just have a hard time understanding how a problem is justified against your safety. Czechmate, you are right I learned my lesson that you get what you pay for, but this problem is a safety problem and you guys who are not taking action our putting others at risk. Just think about it. American dealers in the US are selling unsafe chinses products and make money from you guys they don't care about your safety or the dealer would correct the problem. That is just wrong!!!!! Allworld, I am a fair person and fell that if scootertronics wants to sell me a scooter that is safe to ride I will be more than happy to except that offer, and make and exchange, I don't see that happening. Lets see I am waiting for scootertronics to response to the message I am sending. There first response was not what I would call customer friendly.... Again Czechmate you are more than right you get what you pay for just be safe on what you ride!!!
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Post by karl55 on Jul 3, 2008 23:05:36 GMT -5
Hi Scooterjake, I changed the oil and added 215Ml to each fork and still they have a metal to metal knock. Go and test ride a honda scooter and let me know if there is a knock in the front forks? You just bought a new scooter why in gods name would you have a knocking sound in the front fork. What really gets me is that others don't see that as a problem and let scootertronics get away with it. Sorry but I find this as a safety issue and when you are on two wheels if you are young and have good health insurance then don't worry about the knock in the font fork you are OK a hospital stay will be good rest for you. I am sorry about being so sarcastic about this subject but it is just wrong...I want my money back I will not ride a scooter with a knock in the front forks not counting the other problems I am having with the vog they are minor...
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Post by r0b on Jul 3, 2008 23:59:35 GMT -5
I'm going to have to suggest maybe you sell it locally, or to someone on the forum. The chances of getting your money back from scootertronics because the forks knock is slim to none.
If they come through, kudos to them, but it would open the door to tons of requests for various issues, something internet dealers are not known for handling.
Have you tried contacting whatever company makes VOG brand directly to see if they would swap out units for you?
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Post by wsy1962 on Jul 4, 2008 0:12:28 GMT -5
I will probably get a lot of people upset with my post. So far when I point out the cost and quality of these scoots someone will correct me that they are wonderful machines. Most likely the ones that try to convince me is probaby a distributor. I agree with Karl55 that his scooter is junk among many scooters being sold. Is there anyone out there with 20K miles and over? It seems like even though the scooter starts out great, IT ALWAYS break because of manufacturing or cheap alloys, always related to junk. I too had faith but know my counterparts as I have many business arrangements in China. Some have process such as ISO 9001 or 9002 or something. I think Hyosung , SYM is the only one that does as far as Chinese manufacturers. With the prices of these junks close to 3500.00 they should not be junks. Add the headache,+ labor + cheap part breaking + crossing fingers = Honda, Suzuki , Yamaha. In fact I see a lot of people on this forum that had already bought a majesty, or burgman 400, with all the time and effort wasted on junk. I value my time and effort and add them to the cost. I have a Honda and ever since I bought it I have ridden it 5200 miles now no issue and paid a lot less than some. PDI's what a joke on a new vehicle. I bet someone is ready to write a big response about nothing in how these scooters are wonderful, They are not and cannot convince me. I will still purchase one if I needed something unreliable, a complete set of replacement parts and I start going to church twice a week. Do a chargeback, get your money back and quit listening to the bullsh!t. Consumers can make or break a business, I am surpised so many are willing to be too overly patient and defending what they bought. Karl good luck and hope you find something reliable (Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki). Everyone has choice and I am not faulting any one, the price is attractive but you are not getting what you paid for. If you paid 1700 then yes, if you paid 2500 and above then ? SOL Karl do a chargeback, you will get your money back, whether the merchant likes it or not. These distributors know what they are doing.
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Post by "Big Guy" on Jul 4, 2008 0:40:41 GMT -5
I will probably get a lot of people upset with my post. So far when I point out the cost and quality of these scoots someone will correct me that they are wonderful machines. Most likely the ones that try to convince me is probaby a distributor. No one in their right mind would try and convince you of anything... you have the right to your opinion. There are lots of these with 20K plus miles. SYM is top of the line Taiwan, and better quality control than the big four in my opinion. Yup, and they don't break right? Funny you have a six or eight week wait for an appointment at most dealers... You'll also see that most have upgraded to the larger displacement 400 and 600cc class for touring power, and most still have their smaller China scoots. And I have 7K problem free miles on my Roketa, had 14K problem free miles on the last one before it was wrecked... so is my Roketa now considered a better value? No one's trying to convince you of anything! People here know what they're buying and go into the deal knowing they have to do the PDI to save money. Most who do, do so knowing that the QC issues must be addressed by the customer and once done, have problem free rides, just like you! The going to Church thing might be helpful anyway ;D Not good advise, do a charge back on an item he did receive? No, work out a deal with the seller, the seller can dispute the charge back. Just because you file a charge back doesn't mean you'll get your money back, but it will make the seller less opt to negotiate with you. You can file a dispute and you might get somewhere, but don't file a charge back. I guess when it comes to financial advise, you really do get what you pay for -Rich
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Post by wsy1962 on Jul 4, 2008 0:54:49 GMT -5
BigGuy, You like quotes and YOU are right you can't convince me, you repeated it so many times... I have my choice and you do too, I choose not junk. You quoted 4-8 weeks for repairs, whats the difference I see these junks being worked on that long so they are just "ok". At least they have shops.. You still don't get the point that these scoots are 3500.00 + headache, maybe you didn't experience any issues or able to resolve them, that is great. There are a lot of people that don't but try. As far as chargebacks let Karl decide. The people that have upgraded that kept their chinese scoots is because they couldn't sell the scoot.... or didnt have to sell anything to buy it. And on the financial advice, sounds like you are in cahoots with the junk scooter manufacturer. If you had to pay for my advice It'll cost more than all your chinese scoots. Thanks
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Post by r0b on Jul 4, 2008 1:22:56 GMT -5
If you paid $3500 for a VOG 260, you were royally screwed.
Good luck with it, I hope you are able to come to an agreement with the distributor / manufacturer to resolve the situation.
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Post by "Big Guy" on Jul 4, 2008 1:47:27 GMT -5
BigGuy, You like quotes and YOU are right you can't convince me, you repeated it so many times... I have my choice and you do too, I choose not junk. Yes, I like quotes so I don't forget to address anything. Oh, and there are a lot of other scoot owners who will call your Honda junk as well, just look on any Vespa forum. It doesn't mean they're right, just rude. This is not a Honda forum, nor is it for Vespas, and your arrogant tone doesn't sit well with me and probably a lot of the other folks here as well. This is a community of good people sharing their experiences with their hobby, some call it a love affair, and demeaning it the way you do is simply bad manners to say the least. And you are seeing more and more shops pop up across the country as this phenomenon matures. All new markets take time to develop. I have never seen a VOG sell for $3500, you have your numbers wrong. The VOG sells for about $2300, and with a good PDI is as good as its competing scoots that sell for $5K plus. I only know three people personally who have them, but all three are very happy with them. Can't sell it? Are you even on the same planet as the rest of us? I sold my il Bello scoot the first day it went up on Craigslist with people calling all day long, so much so, I had to delete the ad. Yup, I sure am! They all got together last night and decided to pay me $500 each per month so that I would defend them from you, the almighty know-all of the scooter world who doesn't even know that Carter bros (SYM) made Honda who they are today! Here's the bottom line wsy1962, you don't like China scoots, and that's fine! But do it somewhere else, because all of us here do, and again, the reason this board is here is to help people, not criticize them. So since you hate them so much, why not just move on to a Honda board? I am also a Vespa owner - how would you like it if I came to your Honda board and starting calling all Honda's junk? -Rich
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Post by isawhim on Jul 4, 2008 4:27:26 GMT -5
Let me get this right...
You are trying to return a scooter because of the way it sounds?
A metal to metal sound... Break-disk, break-pad-shims, shock-tubes, shock-springs, hydraulic line vibration, wire-tie-back rubbing the forks, loose washer, missing spacer on wheel-axle... could be a lot of things...
That is like saying that you want to return your car, because it the door has an annoying click when you close it. Um, the locking latch.
Have you had a mechanic inspect the bike, and determine if the sound was harmful, damaging, normal, unfixable, and unsafe in any way?
All scooters make odd sounds. You just said the the other vogs make the same sound. Could it be that all scooters make that sound, but yours is just more quiet, so you hear it louder?
If you are completely unhappy, and the bike has not been registered. (If you registered it, you accepted it as OK. It is not impossible to return, but that makes it more difficult.)
In any event, you will still need to prove that there is reason to return it, other than paranoia of creepy sounds. You need a mechanic to determine what it is, if it is harmful to the life of the bike, if it is harmful to the operation of the bike or your life... Then, you file a BBB report/claim not a complaint. (You found something of concern, and have legal mechanical documentation to confirm the concern.)
File one for the MANUFACTURE first. The place that sold you the bike, did not manufacture it. Contact them, if you can... and let them know the issue. They may have to recall the bikes, or setup a local solution.
At that time, if you are still unhappy... With the legal document in your hands, (The mechanic's report.), call the place that you purchased the bike from, and tell them you want a replacement that has been inspected, and checked for this similar issue. So it does not have the same problem.
If you don't want the bike at all. Tell them that, and I am sure they will try to make an arrangement. Don't be surprised if they charge you for the miles on the bike. Essentially, you rented it. If you did not register it, there should be no problems. If you did register it... You are going to have to ask the DMV what needs to be done. You can not return a vehicle to them, which is still registered, unless it is going to be repaired and returned.
I believe that simply requires you to turn in your plates. As proof that you are not just throwing plates on another vehicle. (Your taxes may also be refundable, if you paid them to get it registered.)
If you can't send it back... Try to sell it, for the same price that you paid for it. I am sure someone will think it is a great deal.
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Post by karl55 on Jul 4, 2008 6:55:54 GMT -5
Hi Isawhim, I have not received the MOC yet from scootertronics so no it has not been registered yet. I have 5 miles on the scooter and from day one the gas gauge and heat gauge does not work, the noise is a loud hard metal to metal banging I was told by mike to replace the fork oil and it will take care of the problem, but the banging sound is still there. I also have two leaks one at the lower right side of the radiator I am not sure were the leak is located and the other is in the area of the motor. I have about a weeks time working on this scooter and still I can't even ride it to work 10 miles away it just sits on its center stand waiting for me to come out and work on it. This scooter is more of a tinker toy then a vehicle for transportion. Scootertronics also charges $2699.00 and wants and extra $99.00 for a PDI and it add a week longer to get the scooter. I don't see paying the extra money I paid as a big problem I though I was getting a good dealer to work with, and we will see how scootertronics handles this It's been two days I've emailed them and and tried to call them with no luck contacting scootermike. I was hoping he would see this message and call me? Now it becomes a waiting game. I will give it three more days and if I can't contact scootermike then I will process the claim with discover card. ...So I am going with the fact that I have a new scooter with 5 miles on it mostly from rolling the scooter around after working on it no MOC and 4 problems stopping me from riding the scooter..The problems are not PDI related. I can't wait to see how this works out...Again thanks for your support and advice.
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Post by karl55 on Jul 4, 2008 7:10:39 GMT -5
Scooterjake, when changing out the oil on the front forks take it to a motorcycle mechanic play it safe. Also you just can't add the coorect amount of oil to the forks you have to drain the oil and see how much is in each tube then add the amount needed to evenly equal each tube, and it is a guess how much oil to fill the tube. I had a friend who is a motorcycle mechanic completely change out the oil with new oil in my forks that is the safe way for both you and the fork tubes.
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Post by karl55 on Jul 4, 2008 8:12:45 GMT -5
Hi Isawhim, I have not received the MOC yet from scootertronics so no it has not been registered yet. I have 5 miles on the scooter and from day one the gas gauge and heat gauge does not work, the noise is a loud hard metal to metal banging I was told by mike to replace the fork oil and it will take care of the problem, but the banging sound is still there. I also have two leaks one at the lower right side of the radiator I am not sure were the leak is located and the other is in the area of the motor. I have about a weeks time working on this scooter and still I can't even ride it to work 10 miles away it just sits on its center stand waiting for me to come out and work on it. This scooter is more of a tinker toy then a vehicle for transportion. Scootertronics also charges $2699.00 and wants and extra $99.00 for a PDI and it add a week longer to get the scooter. I don't see paying the extra money I paid as a big problem I though I was getting a good dealer to work with, and we will see how scootertronics handles this It's been two days I've emailed them and and tried to call them with no luck contacting scootermike. I was hoping he would see this message and call me? Now it becomes a waiting game. I will give it three more days and if I can't contact scootermike then I will process the claim with discover card. ...So I am going with the fact that I have a new scooter with 5 miles on it mostly from rolling the scooter around after working on it no MOC and 4 problems stopping me from riding the scooter..The problems are not PDI related. I can't wait to see how this works out...Again thanks for your support and advice.
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Post by "Big Guy" on Jul 4, 2008 8:36:56 GMT -5
...The problems are not PDI related... Hey Karl, I have to disagree with you on this to some degree. Unfortunately, most dealers do a literal PDI (Pre-delivery inspection) and it is just that... they look at it! They charge the battery and check a few things, but that's about it. Now on these China scoots, it is commonly known to the members here and experienced China scooterists that they have inherent quality control issues, but this is not known to the general public, or people with no experience with China scoots. So while you may indeed be getting a scooter for 1/2 price, there is a catch. Caveat emptor (Latin for "Let the buyer beware") applies to everything you buy for 1/2 price. The problem is, if you do not do your own PDI similar to the one I have posted in my signature below, you will have problems. The second problem is, these scoots are marketed improperly. A good seller should tell their customers what to expect and how to overcome the typical problems of the quality control. 99% of the folks who buy these don't even know that they come filled with shipping and storage fluids, and not oil and anti-freeze! In fact, most sellers don't even know this! So to cut to the chase here, if the question were posted to me, would I accept a scoot that came with problems like you're having? My answer would be that I knew this going in... perhaps you didn't. Your best bet would be to try and work this out with the seller. Maybe ask for a new set of forks? But I can tell you that without a proper PDI, you'll likely not be happy with a China scoot. Whatever happens, I hope you can get this resolved to your satisfaction... Good luck, -Rich
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Post by rusty on Jul 4, 2008 9:08:13 GMT -5
It seems to me that some people buy these scooters thinking they are perfect and when they find out that they may have a small probrlem with them, they either dont know how or dont want to work on them they find excuses for their own incompence (sp) and they to take it out on the dealer. I didnt buy from scootertronics because of price, my income is low, but I knew that I would have to my own maintance on it. I did alot of reading on this and other fourms brfore I got my scooter and I was prepaired for the task at hand so ther was no surprises when I had to tighten some screwa change some fluids and keep a check on other things.
I think what we have here is a person that is very hard to please, I have been in retails sales befor and theres nothing you can do with this type of person. nothing is ever good enough for them, and even a refund dose not appease them they will still complane that they got a bad deal. and its it your fault that they have to go shop smewhre esle and you should refund them for their time they spent trying to make the happy.
I dont see anything short of him giving up scooters and getting a car or suv that has a lifetime warrenty on it. So my 2 cents worth is either learn how to work on you scooter and enjoy it like the rest of us do here or keep your feelings to youself and let the rest of us on our cheap China Scooters enjoy the ride and also enjoying the time we spend tinkering on them and dressing them up or making mods or anything else we like doing to our scooters
Sorry for going on, i dont normaly do this but some things get under my skin, so if i offended any one here sorry, but I like my scooter and the peopl i meet with it and i like this fourm for its knolage and mosty frienly folks here
Rusty
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Post by isawhim on Jul 4, 2008 9:29:35 GMT -5
Ok... do this...
(To me, this seems like a legitimate claim. It didn't at first, from the lack of information.)
File a claim with the BBB for the place that you purchased the scooter from. Mention that it has been "Difficult", not "Impossible", to contact the dealer by telephone. (Remember, it is the holidays, and scooter-boom is taking a toll on these places.)
That claim should provide all contact info that you can provide, along with the website and business name. "llc., co., mfg. etc..." Include things like your VIN, transaction info, dates, telephone numbers, emails, addresses... etc...
The BBB will contact them, on your behalf, for resolution. That will also be your legal claim of, "Attempt to contact", for that date, which the claim was made.
Also, for your records, send an email, and put yourself as the CC address. That will forward the letter back to you, and to them, as a second proof of contact.
After that... contact your Credit card people, and tell them that you wish to file a formal notice to hold payment, until a resolution has been met, by the recipient of the funds. They will not give you your money back, they will simply hold it, until an attempt to resolve the matter has completed to your satisfaction. (Even it that includes returning it. Which will result in the deposit back into your account.)
If you do not get resolution, after 30 days... Feel free to change the claim status to "Complaint", and then tell the credit card people that you have not been contacted.
Keep an eye on the BBB page, and your e-mails, or they will turn it around on you, and say that you are the one who is not able to be contacted. (Thus, you will be the proud new owner of a banging, leaking, overheating new VOG.)
(That is from the Florida department... Try the national one, or the one where the company is located... not where you are located.)
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Post by mafunsalow on Jul 4, 2008 11:06:03 GMT -5
I will probably get a lot of people upset with my post. So why do it ? You think you've said something that hasn't been said before, here or on other boards? You talk about quality and ISO certified, and I'm pretty sure the big'uns use their standards, then why so many recalls. Here's a list of MC/Scooter recalls so far this year, BMW is recalling 30 MY 2008 K1200 S and K1200 GT motorcycles BMW is recalling 1,980 MY 2007-2008 F800 S and F800 ST motorcycles BMW is recalling 75 MY 2008 K1200 S and GT motorcycles American Suzuki is recalling 9,109 MY 2008 GSX1300R motorcycles Ducati is recalling 3,614 MY 2007-2008 Models 1098, 1098S, and 1098 Tricolore motorcycles BMW is recalling 3,248 MY 2007-2008 R1200 R, MY 2006-2007 R1200 GS and MY 2007 R1200 ST motorcycles. Buell is recalling 1,579 MY 2008 1125R motorcycles Kawasaki is recalling certain MY 2006-2007 ZX14 motorcycles Kawasaki is recalling 1,393 MY 2009 KLX250T9F and KLX250T9FL motorcycles. Kawasaki is recalling 487 MY 2008 EX250J8F and EX250J8FL motorcycles. United Motors is recalling 1,145 MY 2007 V2C-650 and V2S-650 series motorcycles. Vectrix is recalling 616 MY 2007 scooters. Yamaha is recalling 9,600 MY 2006-2007 CP250 and MY 2005-2007 YP400 motorcycles.Kawasaki is recalling 3,611 MY 2008 ZG1400A8F, ZG1400A8FL, ZG1400B8F, and ZG1400B8FL motorcycles. Kawasaki is recalling 4,645 MY 2008 ZG1400A8F, ZG1400A8FL, ZG1400B8F, and ZG1400B8FL motorcycles. Kawasaki is recalling 532 MY 2008 Ninja EX250J8F and EX250J8FL motorcycles. Hyosung is recalling 3,292 MY 2005-2007 GT650 and GV650 motorcycles. Harley-Davidson is recalling 5,947 MY 2005-2007 FLHP, FLHPI, FLHTP, FLHTPI, FLHPE and FLHPEI police and escort motorcycles BMW is recalling 1,391 MY 2007 G650X Challenge, Country, and Moto motorcycles. BMW is recalling 744 MY 2007 G650X Challenger and Country motorcycles. Kawasaki is recalling 31,789 Vulcan 900 Classic, Custom and Classic LT models, MY 2006 VN900B6F, VN900B6FL, VN900D6F, VN900D6FL, MY 2007 VN900B7F, VN900B7FL, VN900C7F, VN900C7FL, VN900D7F, VN900D7FL, MY 2008 VN900B8F, VN900B8FL, VN900C8F, VN900D8F and VN900D8FL motorcycles. Kawasaki is recalling 1,526 MY 2008 EX250J8F and EX250J8FL motorcycles. Triumph is recalling 265 MY 2008 Street Triple motorcycles. Polaris is recalling 1,585 MY 2008 Victory Vision motorcycles. Honda is recalling 38,934 MY 2006-2007 VT600 and MY 2007-2008 VT750 and VTX1300 motorcycles. Triumph is recalling 356 MY 2008 rocket III touring motorcycles Piaggio is recalling 10 MY 2008 Aprilia Tuono 1000 R motorcycles Piaggio's MP3 had a recent recall Last year Vespa had a recall on over 2700 GTS's 2006, the Burgman Sym is the only manufacturer that I haven't found a recall for. I know there seems to be very little recall for Chinese products and none for Chinese MC/Scooters. Should there? Definately! But there isn't but even if there was where would you take a dropshipped scoot to get repaired, it's generally hard to find a place that will work on it in the first place. It is what it is. We deal with it. You say people are risking their lives because of "cheap Chinese junk" and I won't disagree with that statement in the least. But at least there is no false sense of security. People are risking their lives with the "expensive American/Japanese/German/Italian quality machines" too! At least doing a PDI you get to know your machine and not just trust it because of a name. wsy1962 I understand your concerns and your probably the nicest person but when I read these chino bashings they come across as telling people you are better than everyone else and you know whats good for us even though some people are not in a position to spend more than they can afford or are willing to lose in case they try scootin and don't like it, which is my case and I do so I will upgrade next year. So instead of belittling people, albeit unintentional (hopefully), why not try supporting peoples decision and try helping solve the problem. Seriously, if your neighbors house was on fire would you stand there telling them how they should have wired their house or would you try and help them. Okay rant over wsy1962 please don't take this as a personal attack, it is meant for all chino bashers , you just presented me the oppurtunity to vent by your first line Karl, sorry not trying to hijack your thread, but I was going to suggest as Rich did, if the noise is coming from the forks and you can get hold of the dealer, try replacing. I believe it would be a warranty part. Use a stethoscope and see if you can isolate the exact spot thats making the grinding noise make sure it is in the forks. Good luck!
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Post by scootermike on Jul 4, 2008 12:08:43 GMT -5
This is scootermike on July 4th in my office working while my family is enjoying the holiday but I had a few things to do today to make sure everyone gets what they need. Today I have 434 emails for products and I am sure I wil see Karls. The post office and UPS are closed for three days. Karl asked that we dropship his scooter and not do a PDI because he was caple of doing everything and fixing evertyhing if there was a problem, I was out of town buying scooters and scooter parts the first four days I belive Karl had his scooter which two days were weekend days plus since he would not let us see the scooter we did not have vin number, I had one day before holiday to send Karl his MCO because of holiday and needed vin from him because he did not want scootertronics to look at his scooter before he got it. He already knew of any problems before he got it because scootdawg members told him all about the Vog and I tried my best to sell a different scooter like Linhai 300. I did talk to Karl on Wed or Thursday, its Friday today on the forth of July and he is mad because I am not calling him, I am now. Read all post on Vog and find out we have sent new shocks. The only thing he was concerned about was his gauges not working, the shocks we talked about for a few minutes about how to remove top to add fork oil which we could have done if we saw it first which Karl DID NOT WANT A PDI AT ALL. I called him the day I shipped it to make sure NO I CAN DO IT MYSELF. and I bet I have an email that says this at least I better since Karl is ready to ruin my rep without even giving me a chance, yes ship it back today for a refund I have plenty of takers, I could send someone who wants to buy one to him I bet.
Please tell me scootdawg members what I should do, its a collective vote after you ask scooter rollie who can come on down and visit us to take a look at Karls Vog 260.
scootermike
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Post by scootermike on Jul 4, 2008 12:22:08 GMT -5
Just an FYI I have not been able to reach Karl but did leave a message he may return at anytime and as long as we receive in perfect condition which is what his email says when he received which was July 2 so thats why he does not have MCO UPS and USPS closed this holiday and weekend.
Again Karl may return at anytime for a refund which includes restocking fee plus any shipping costs, if this is wrong please let me know.
This I hope and plan to make it my last post on this subject. Karl may return his scooter at anytime. Its strange because he had to have it and said no PDI, I would never ship a scooter that was broken if I know about it, think about it, we have done two dropships this year, scootertronics does not dropship scooters unless customer is demanding it.
I wan to help people with thier scooters on scootdawg not have thi shappen, he may return, repeat this five times, he may return, no problem.
scootermike
scootermike
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Post by A.B.Normal on Jul 4, 2008 12:43:57 GMT -5
Just an FYI I have not been able to reach Karl but did leave a message he may return at anytime and as long as we receive in perfect condition which is what his email says when he received which was July 2 so thats why he does not have MCO UPS and USPS closed this holiday and weekend. Again Karl may return at anytime for a refund which includes restocking fee plus any shipping costs, if this is wrong please let me know. This I hope and plan to make it my last post on this subject. Karl may return his scooter at anytime. Its strange because he had to have it and said no PDI, I would never ship a scooter that was broken if I know about it, think about it, we have done two dropships this year, scootertronics does not dropship scooters unless customer is demanding it. I wan to help people with thier scooters on scootdawg not have thi shappen, he may return, repeat this five times, he may return, no problem. scootermike scootermike Thumbs up, scootermike. Sorry your having to toil a bit this holiday, but it's good to see you doing right by your customers. hope the two of you can solve this problem with a win-win scenario.
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Post by shark on Jul 4, 2008 12:45:00 GMT -5
Mike, You have always done me right....I'm sure others will agree. My Vog is one Kick Ass scooter... Took a 40 mile cruise today w/ speeds up to 70 and grins the whole way.... It just keeps running stronger and stronger!!! happy 4th all
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Post by scootermike on Jul 4, 2008 12:58:55 GMT -5
I am blown away by the way Karl is dragging me thru the mud, this is how I support four families we do not play around, they are all not mine, but my lead guy Tommy Thunder has a wife and kids and they work also so we are not sitting around selling on ebay.
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Post by Greg on Jul 4, 2008 13:35:49 GMT -5
Micheal ,youve done right by me i love my vog and it has the fork noise but it dosnt affect the way the bike ride or handles imho it dose not affect the safty of the bike in any way ,, and also imho scootertronics is #1 The prep shouldnt be an option just prep every bike and add it to the cost of the bike As far as Karl just make him happy he has been the only 1 to claim the vog as junk and there have been a few problems with them but that dost make them junk by any means i love the one i have ,,and have been very happy with the service i have gottin from scootertronics Greg
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Post by jimk on Jul 4, 2008 13:57:29 GMT -5
It doesn't surprise me.. Like I've said before, there are too many people who expect too much.. I mean complaining because you haven't got the MCO on a holiday weekend is insane.. And I am sure he did say not to do the PDI, I am sure he said he can handle it.. And now, he found that he doesn't know anything about bikes, and it's making some noise that some "know-it-all" has said is dangerous, and he is going to get his money back, and not take any responsibility.. NOONE takes responsibility anymore.. God forbid YOU should do anything wrong, Your perfect and the smartest person in the world.. It really ticks me off, And this wsy1962 guy, wow.. You are looking at the world through some crazy glasses buddy, Very few motorcycles out there have 30,000 on them even after 10 years, because most people are riding them in the warm months, and not that often.. The REAL bikers who ride ALLOT have lots of maintenance on them because they DO put that kind of mileage on them.. Also Honda Motorcycles are made here in my state, Ohio, and I go to the plant regularly.. I know what goes on there, and what kind of quality control they have.. I also know for a FACT that many of the parts used are manufactured in CHINA.. And many are the same parts that go in the scoots.. the ones that you are bashing... Seriously... Also did you know that the Honda FIT, that cute little car they are advertising like crazy lately, is made in CHINA?? yup... Research it... I tell no lie.. I don't have to.. You've told enough for everyone... examples of his lies: lie #1:It seems like even though the scooter starts out great, IT ALWAYS break because of manufacturing or cheap alloys, always related to junk. lie #2:With the prices of these junks close to 3500.00 they should not be junks (none of them are close to that price.. WHat are you smoking?) lie #3:PDI's what a joke on a new vehicle. Why do you think the Honda and Yamahas cost $5000??? Because they have a store, a repair shop and they do a PDI on EVERY bike they get before they sell it... The ones that don't get a good PDI end up becoming known as lemons.. Oh wait what am I saying, Honda doesn't sell lemons.. all their bikes are perfect.. I forgot.. Thanks for telling me that wsy1962.. I could keep going, but I am sure everyone gets the point...
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Post by Troy Young on Jul 4, 2008 14:52:05 GMT -5
Seriously... Also did you know that the Honda FIT, that cute little car they are advertising like crazy lately, is made in CHINA?? yup... Research it... I tell no lie.. I don't have to.. Not taking sides in this argument but this statement made me curious so I Googled it and came up with a Wikipedia entry. Here's what they said about it: The Fit is produced in 5 factories throughout the world. Suzuka (Japan), Sumaré (Brazil), Guangzhou (China), Ayutthaya (Thailand), and Karawang (Indonesia). Models produced in Japan are for Honda's home market, exported to Europe, some Asian markets, as well as Canada and the United States. The Brazilian factory supplies all of Latin America and the Caribbean. Chinese models are sold in mainland China (please note the Honda Jazz in Hong Kong is made in Japan), and also being exported to some left hand drive European markets.
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Post by jimk on Jul 4, 2008 15:02:01 GMT -5
Seriously... Also did you know that the Honda FIT, that cute little car they are advertising like crazy lately, is made in CHINA?? yup... Research it... I tell no lie.. I don't have to.. Not taking sides in this argument but this statement made me curious so I Googled it and came up with a Wikipedia entry. Here's what they said about it: The Fit is produced in 5 factories throughout the world. Suzuka (Japan), Sumaré (Brazil), Guangzhou (China), Ayutthaya (Thailand), and Karawang (Indonesia). Models produced in Japan are for Honda's home market, exported to Europe, some Asian markets, as well as Canada and the United States. The Brazilian factory supplies all of Latin America and the Caribbean. Chinese models are sold in mainland China (please note the Honda Jazz in Hong Kong is made in Japan), and also being exported to some left hand drive European markets. You do know wikipedia is not an encyclopedia right? It is a user editable website.. Anyone can post ANYthing on wikipedia.. That sight has NO MERIT and is basically a blog page as far as I am concerned.. The Fit is mostly made in China, and exported all over the world as the Fit or the Jazz.. here in the US it is called the Fit, in parts of europe and asia it is known as the Jazz.. THere are VERY few parts made in Japan, some of the fuel delivery parts, some of the plastic and exaust parts as well as the radiators are made in the Columbus Ohio area by companies like Tiger Poly, and TS TECH.. I work with these people DAILY, I see the parts that are made and imported.. Trust me.. The FIT is a CHINESE car... Let me also add that too many times people mistake MANUFACTURING and ASSEMBLY.. and think they are all done at the same place... guess what, they ARENT! A production plant for automobiles may not actually be where the parts are made.. but where they are ASSEMBLED.. Again, much of the interior and trim parts are made right here in Columbus Ohio at TS Tech, then exported to China JApan and other places.. SO some of the parts are US made.. This doesn't make it an american car... Many of Honda's higher priced vehicles are more made in America than anywhere else.. ALL of the Interior parts for the Accord are made here, Most of the engine parts are made here, and most of the body panels are made here... And it's ASSEMBLED HERE... Makes it more american than a Ford.. Which is made in Mexico, CAnada, and Japan..
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