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Post by sdg on Jun 12, 2008 11:09:17 GMT -5
You know what guys, as much as I want to reframe from speaking about ATVD, I must!
Let me ask you this:
If you asked me if I has something in stock and I told you yes it was, with out any doubt and it will ship asap. Even though you know that no one else has them and you are explaining the reason you want to buy from me is due to the fact that no one else has them currently. Now I tell you over and over that yes I do have it and it will go asap, then I do not say anymore to you for a couple weeks, even though you have sent me emails, made phone calls etc. Now at this time would you be curious why I am not responding to your questions? I would think so. Now after couple weeks go by, I finally contact you after many more emails and calls and tell you that yes I have checked into it and you are inline at the warehouse, you will get your item soon. Now still nothing on your tracking. How do feel right now? Now 3 1/2 weeks later you call me and demand answers, again I tell you that it just takes time and you will get your item soon, but then you say I want answer right now. Well ok, I call you right back. How you feeling right now? Now I don't call you back, how you feeling right now? Next day you try again, this time you will not accept that I call you back. Then you are put on hold for over an hr. How you feeling now? Ok, I tell you I am geting to the bottom of it but it will take more time , what is your number I call you back asap, I promise! , how do you feel now? Well I dont call you back, but... I have the Salesmen call you back 3 hrs. later. And guess what he tells you! "WE DO NOT HAVE THAT ITEM IN STOCK AND WE CAN NOT GET IT" how you feeling now? Now I want to say that there is alot more bs inbetween but you get the idea of it.
Look guys, it's not always about the money, In my case I was willing to pay more for what I wanted if it was avail, not a cash problem but more of a time issue. You may say and claim you get what you pay for, well what I paid for was a bunch of lies and deciet! You all can say all you want about this company and I assume there will be more people buying from them. My point is, this is a crap shoot with these guys, they DO lie and scam you into thinking you are getting something you are not. I have in writing all the issues with them stating over and over they have the item I ordered. Good thing due to them wanting to charge me $75 for a cancellation fee. Needless to say I am now getting a full refund and going to a more reputable dealer.
I would not be writing this thread if it wernt for some of you praising this company thinking its all about what you pay. Everyone can buy through whom they wish, but I can tell you if I would have had this information at the time I placed the order I would have ran as fast as I could. Enough said!
sdg
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Post by "Big Guy" on Jun 12, 2008 11:49:32 GMT -5
Well... they just want in on the buying frenzy, and they'll say anything to get the orders, it's just that simple! Is it good business? No... Is it legal? No... there are Truth in Advertising laws. Does it make them money? Yup! Until the frenzy of 08, I used to buy from them, even with their questionable practices because they always delivered and backed the warranty. But now? Probably not... unless they have it in stock in Dallas. I might ride up and pick it up. With the supply and demand the way it is right now, you have to be willing to wait 6-8 weeks or more for your scoot. If you are, then you have no problem, but if you're depending on what they tell you? You'll pull your hair out... they have always been known to fudge... today, it's just outright lies and for those who wait, they make their money. More wait than cancel, that's how they get away with it. -Rich
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Post by meloyelo on Jun 12, 2008 14:54:50 GMT -5
You're all missing the point. A report and a complaint are not the same thing. A complaint expresses your feelings and opinions and is usually backed by anger or disappointment. A report is accurate and unbiased.
For the last two months I've been reading these posts. I've read of experiences with ATVD, both good and bad, but almost all bad. For the same last two months, I've seen people who order from them anyways. Then they come back here to complain about the crappy service that they had just read about. That's just stupid. You are all correct in that this is the place to report. But after sooooo many bad reports, why order from them.
If I say to you "don't buy that pen because it'll leak in your pocket" and you go ahead and buy it anyway, then it leaks in your pocket, is it my fault? Is it the fault of the manufaturer? Maybe. Sure, they could and should make a better pen, and I'm sure they don't tell people their pens will leak. But someone had giving you advice and you failed to take it.
Now you have a dirty shirt.
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Post by sdg on Jun 12, 2008 15:43:40 GMT -5
So...meloyelo,
You seem to be a bit offensive here, if you have read all these post, and I quote "but almost all bad" Than why did you order from them?
The real point here is not if it is a "report" or a "complaint" This is an area on this forum to talk about experiances you have had with scooter dealers, rather its writtin in a form of a complaint or a report. Hense the title of this area "Scooter Dealers, The Good and The Bad"
This area is where people can express their views, opinions and explain thier experiances in a way that they beleive is making a point.
I am happy for you that your experiance turned out in a good way, not all have had such a good experiance. That is why they have come to this spot to share, explore and learn.
Let it be known that we all want the best for all our fellow dawgs, this was the main reason I signed up and writing this. Please dont take me the wrong way, but I feel like you are telling me that I asked for everything I got because I did not head the warnings. I did read as much as I could, I did think this could get ugly. But like others I thought after talking with a live person and putting TRUST in what they say it could turn out ok. Now a days as I am finding out there is no trust or morals with some internet dealers. So all I want to do is explain what my experiance was to all those who wish to read it. They can make thier own judgments just like you and I have done. "Good or Bad"
sdg
By the way, my pen is not leaking cause I never got one!
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Post by leshassell on Jun 12, 2008 19:33:19 GMT -5
My pen isn't leaking, either... I've been requesting the ink for over six weeks.
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Post by meloyelo on Jun 12, 2008 21:29:30 GMT -5
Hello again,
I don't mean to be offensive, I didn't mean for it to come out that way. I don't really care either way about ATVD. They are just the company I purchased my scoot from. I have no loyalty to them or any other dealer for that matter. I certainly do not want to see anybody (dawg or not) screwed out of their money or more important (IMO), time which you can not get back. That's what I've been trying to get across.
I agree 100% that this is the place to post your experiences (good or bad). That's the purpose of this site. But the system backfires when people don't heed the warnings from fellow members. Trust must be earned, so when a salesman tells me something about a product he's selling; I take it with a grain of salt. Then you have this community, whom I would trust before any salesmen because we are all mostly after the same thing, and I've seen nothing but dawgs trying to be helpful. These are the guys people should be listening to. Talk about judgement.
I started this threat to report on my experience (my 1st thread). As it progressed, I've noticed that no one wants to admit the real facts. ATVD didn't put a gun to your head and make you order from them. Nor did members say "don't order from ATVD or else we'll ban you". No, members came here and used a system that's here to help and in some way protect the next guy from making the same mistake. That's where judgement (or lack thereof) come into play.
It's kind of hard to make people who have been done wrong to understand the point I'm trying to make. I also want what's best for the community. That is also why I post. But what good is it to want and try to do good when people don't listen. It may sound harsh, but it's the truth. Members bitch ad nauseum about their business practices and share their experiences with us and yet we still bite. And yes, I believe that we, as consumers, have some to take some responsability for what happens to us. You said it yourself, the name of this board is the "good and the bad". Why would you order from the bad? If you read the horrors and still ordered from them, then I repeat. It's on you. That's what these boards are for. It works just like Ebays feedback system, you would order from someone who has a low feedback rating?
BTW, I don't want to be known as a mr. negative. Please realize that I am really trying to help. I want people to realize we are all to here to help (yes, even me). I want to see people use this site to educate themseves, so they don't get screwed. Then in turn, they can educate others and so on.
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Tobor
Big Dawg
The 8th Man
Posts: 23
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Post by Tobor on Jun 12, 2008 21:54:03 GMT -5
I'm very appreciative of both the negative and positive posts. If nothing else, it gives a well-rounded picture of what is going on with a vendor.
Unfortunately, I failed to do my research before ordering. That was my fault. As soon as I started looking for info, I found plenty. Still, I have found lots of useful information that I believe will help me deal with problems with my vendor (should they arise).
On a separate note, I would be interested to hear a discussion about the general business practices of all the online vendors. They seem to follow very similar business models, and from what I'm reading, most suffer from the same type delays in shipping. I could be wrong, but there does seem to be a trend amongst vendors. Maybe a new thread will deal with those issues.
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Post by allworld on Jun 13, 2008 21:12:52 GMT -5
Hello sdg; I am glad to here that you are getting a refund. I remember when you placed the order, I was leery then and posted this; It would seem that rerun2 is right with the popularity of certain models of scooters, and I believe there are some less than scrupulous dealers. I put together a list of the scooters I would like then carefully went over each one, one of the parameters was availability, since price and demand go hand in hand. There are many good scooters the more I look the more the more impressed I am. If you can't get the VOG, keep looking. I personally chose the Linhai 300. I hope that what and where you buy a scooter, everything works out.
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Post by sdg on Jun 13, 2008 22:13:31 GMT -5
Hey Allworld,
Thanks a bunch, u should get some karma for being so nice, appreceate it!
Working with Scootertronics now. it will all work out in the end, i know it will. love this place, full of nice poeple, seems the more you try to help your self it ends up helping others as much or more! Hope you like your ride, enjoy your adventure, i am hoping to ride before July. For now just enjoying everyone elses experiances. thanks again! sdg ps writing from my phone sorry for spelling
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Post by GAZZOO on Jun 14, 2008 7:33:43 GMT -5
Best of luck sdg.
See you on the road.
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Post by tvh on Jun 15, 2008 19:03:54 GMT -5
I was told my mco was sent out first class mail on June 2. I have not seen it yet. How long does it take for a pkg to get from Texas to Michigan?
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Post by meloyelo on Jun 15, 2008 19:33:06 GMT -5
tvh. I see you got the sc-27 from ATVD. I had a small issue with the MSO they sent for my SL-150-18. When they filled it out, they listed the make as SUNL not the manufacturer, Shenke or Zhejiang. So when I went to register it, the DMV said it wasn't listed with the NHTSA (I checked and it's not). I contacted ATVD for a corrected copy of the MSO, but as you can imagine, no response. What I did was contact Sunl directly as they have headquarters here in NJ. They were able to give me a new MSO with the right information. Don't know how it works in your state, but worth looking into before you make numerous trip to the DMV as I did.
BTW, my SL-150-18 is a dream. You will love it.
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Post by sleeper on Jun 16, 2008 8:13:49 GMT -5
update: finally. i see an update to the tracking number. it has been picked up and is on its way to VA.
33 days and counting....
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Post by mmad on Jun 16, 2008 9:23:49 GMT -5
Well someone finally sent out last month mail. My tracking number now shows up.
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Post by plsscootover on Jun 16, 2008 9:27:34 GMT -5
update: 24 days (16 business) and counting. After waiting on hold for 30 minutes on monday last week, I was told it would ship by friday but I see this morning that shipping has not yet begun, they still haven't replied to a single email inquiry about my order. their website doesn't list the bike I bought anymore either, which isn't a promising sign....
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Post by plsscootover on Jun 16, 2008 9:29:48 GMT -5
oh, does anyone know is there a 30 day limit for an (easier) refund to a person's credit card? I know with a great degree of trouble, you can get a refund up to 90 days......
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Post by rsperko on Jun 16, 2008 12:09:40 GMT -5
I ordered a SC-35 from ATVD on 5/18/08 and received it on 6/12/08. Much longer than they indicated. It was supposed to be assembled. The handlebars were not attached, the front fender was not attached, and the front wheel was off. It took me much longer to address these things than I expected. I assume that unassembled means you receive a block of iron, block of carbon, and block of plastic with instructions "first combine carbon with iron to make steel..."
I was told today that the MCO shipped today. I hope that is true.
Regardless, I went into this with very low expectations and while some were met, others were exceeded. Almost all the parts were there. It runs well. I paid $863 for a 150cc scooter that is very nice looking. I believe I am going to pay one way or another, and convenience and shipping speed where the coin I used so far.
Just my $.02. Thank you all for being here. I have learned a lot from this forum and plan to continue visiting it.
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Post by sleeper on Jun 16, 2008 12:52:43 GMT -5
scootover---
i did look into the CC cancellation issue, as i was passing the 30 day as well (i'm with chase bank). i was asking whether i would have a problem if i dispute it after i've paid, rather than refusing to pay. CS girl told me not to worry. she suggested i go as late as possible on payment of bill, and wait and see if it arrives. thats what i'm doing. i've had to refuse a couple times before and everyone was pretty nice about it. call them, tell them you want to dispute, they will mail you a real easy short form. if you simply say you never received the item, its very straightforward. the "30 vs less than 30" has nothing to do with it.
i assume if you accept delivery, that will be another story. but it seems clear your shipment time will be greater than 30 days from ATVD. good luck.
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Tobor
Big Dawg
The 8th Man
Posts: 23
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Post by Tobor on Jun 16, 2008 14:35:23 GMT -5
What is the current "industry standard" for delivery when purchasing a scooter online? The reason I'm posing this question is that a number of threads, both on this site and others, leads me to believe that demand is far outweighing supplies right now. From what I'm able to discern, it seems like most online dealers are basically drop-shipping bikes. Some might do some PDI before fulfilling orders, but all seem to be waiting for shipments to arrive these days.
It seems to me that the advantage of buying online can be boiled down to PRICE. The immediate drawback seems to be that you most likely will have to wait about 30-45 days for an order to get delivered. After that, the big issue seems to be the ability of the company to provide warranty service and/or parts.
Is 30-45 days totally unreasonable within the industry right now?
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Tobor
Big Dawg
The 8th Man
Posts: 23
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Post by Tobor on Jun 16, 2008 15:41:53 GMT -5
And literally as I was writing the above, I received a phone call from the shipping company. He said he had my scoot on his truck and wanted to drop it off.
Placed my order with ATVD on 4 June, the driver should be here soon. Never even received a tracking #. I have another thread that details my order. I will post pics and give more details there.
Hopefully I'll get the correct bike and hopefully it will be damage free/running condition!
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Post by GAZZOO on Jun 16, 2008 16:49:32 GMT -5
tobor, lucky for you. I was waiting for my scooters to be delivered today as promised by the shipping company. But to find out, they are still about 450mi. west of me.
They are saying "Tomorrow it will arrive".
We'll see.
Neal
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Tobor
Big Dawg
The 8th Man
Posts: 23
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Post by Tobor on Jun 16, 2008 21:21:54 GMT -5
If anyone cares to read the details of my purchase/delivery experience with ATVD, and/or to see pics of how the delivery & assembly went, you can read them on this thread: LINK
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Post by GAZZOO on Jun 17, 2008 12:04:10 GMT -5
UPDATE: Looked up my scooters on Estes-Express.com to see where they are, and they are STILL sitting in the same exact spot.
Called the depot, and they said the'd "red tag" the order to make sure it will be here tomorrow. (Wasn't that the promise yesterday? LOL!)
OH WELL!, Whats another day.
Neal
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Post by sleeper on Jun 18, 2008 6:52:18 GMT -5
tobor---
thanks for the great post on the delivery/assembly. excellent pix, very helpful.
did not order exact same model as you, but i'm expecting my SUNL in a day or two. wanna be prepared. i'll have my camera ready as well. my SC-09 is alleged to be "assembled" but i'll be ready for anything. any issues to report so far?
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Post by GAZZOO on Jun 19, 2008 20:35:26 GMT -5
UPDATE: Looked up my scooters on Estes-Express.com to see where they are, and they are STILL sitting in the same exact spot. Called the depot, and they said the'd "red tag" the order to make sure it will be here tomorrow. (Wasn't that the promise yesterday? LOL!) OH WELL!, Whats another day. Neal Scooters delivered today... YEAY!!! The Roketa MC54 was a "B" not the "A" I ordered. It was silver, (that was OK, but I ordered black. No biggie). My wife ordered the Roketa Bali and got a SUNL ? instead. UGGGGGGGJ!!! WTF!
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Post by glassvial on Jun 19, 2008 21:40:00 GMT -5
gazzoo, did you get a real B (Linhai motor) or a fake B (CF Moto motor)?
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Post by GAZZOO on Jun 20, 2008 1:46:28 GMT -5
Actually, don't know...I didn't dig into it far enough to see if it was the real Linhai or the CF Moto. I was more intrested in the longer track of the CF Moto. My main gripe is I got a $800 scooter instead of the Bali I ordered for my wife. I think she is going to divorce me.
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Post by sleeper on Jun 20, 2008 6:53:32 GMT -5
hey all--- hooray for me, yesterday was the day!
received a call from southeastern freight on weds, they had the scooter and wanted to deliver it! set delivery for thursday and she assured me the driver would phone in advance. left the office early and got to my place. soon the truck appeared. but no call. good thing i decided to leave when i did, that would have been a problem had i not been there.
we have a loading dock at my building and driver had a pallet jack. the offload was not bad, myself and the driver handled it, though dock and trailer were a foot different in height. the packing crate was pretty solid. it was not the metal-frame-type deal i've been seeing. crate was all cardboard plus an wood pallet. packed pretty secure anyway, so it was fine.
the scooter was correct model and color (SC-09, red) and seems to be in good shape. there were a few surface scratches but no real damage. "fully assembled" it was not, however the setup was fairly straighforward. filled the battery and put it on a charger for an hour. i could not even figure out how to access the engine, so i got a little impatient did not prime the carb. after a lot of cranking, it started.
it had started raining by then, but i took it for a quick run anyway. ran great. have photos and will post them soon. also a few questions for you guys. more to follow....
it was 36 days total.
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Post by glassvial on Jun 20, 2008 9:33:54 GMT -5
Actually, don't know...I didn't dig into it far enough to see if it was the real Linhai or the CF Moto. I was more intrested in the longer track of the CF Moto. Well it's easy to tell, if you look at the pics in the sticky of the 250 thread. Reason I ask is because many have been receiving "fake" B scooters (with the CF engine instead of the Linhai) and I'm still trying to track down the rhyme/reason.
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Post by kaybee on Jun 22, 2008 23:09:43 GMT -5
Hi all!
I ordered their model #SC-02 (their cheapest $688 model) 50cc which was originally supposed to be a Sunl on May 6th. I received a tracking number within the week for Estes Express (Old Dominion) but the thing didn't leave their warehouse till well after May 20th. Of course it arrived at the delivery terminal on the Friday before Memorial Day weekend so it didn't get brought over until Tuesday, May 27th.
I ended up receiving a Roketa MC-08 in the color I requested. It took hubby and I most of the afternoon to put it together but it started up fine and has been a fun little bike.
HOWEVER, it's now June 22nd and I'm still cruising back streets avoiding police cars because my MSO still hasn't been sent after THREE requests!
************** After knowing about their rotten customer service, my husband decided to order his 150cc SC-38 (their number) from them anyway because they had the best price. The model he ordered is supposed to have 14 or 16 inch wheels (different websites had different dimensions for the same bike). I hope to gawd that whatever he receives has the 14 or 16 inch wheels or he's NOT going to be happy. We placed this order on June 4th and still no tracking number.
I emailed them last week about both orders and by Friday I received responses from both the shipping and titling depts. The shipping dept claims they are at 12-14 days for shipping (which looks like a lie according to other posts here) and the titling dept. said they needed my VIN number AGAIN!
We've wasted 2 vacations waiting for these bikes so far and if his bike doesn't ship by tomorrow, which most likely won't happen, we will be sitting here still on his 3rd vacation coming up the week of July 4th.
I guess, if it's any concellation, there hasn't been anybody totally ripped off by them.....or at least I haven't read of anyone. I hope everyone eventually gets what they need and has fun with their new toys!
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