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Post by limeracer on Jun 12, 2006 7:36:37 GMT -5
Finally I have found a great set up for ultimate speed and performance on my Primo Strada RX150. 155cc cyl kit Oversized valve head with larger ports A9 camshaft MRP exhaust 30mm Keihin carb w/ 130 main jet Dr. Pulley 12 gram and 14 gram weights (3 of each) Racing Variator 1000 RPM clutch springs Yellow main clutch spring Sponge type air filter (removal of stock air box) No rev limit ignition module Iridium spark plug Orange racing type plug wire and cap Removal of black triangular air blockers in front fairing Cut off rear fender at bottom of lic. plate Removal of rear luggage rack plastic and cut off metal bracket to create a center stand handle Michelin Pilot Sport tires Royal Purple synthetic oil with Lucas oil additive Scooter is so fast it sucks you back in the seat now. I am impressed, passing cars like they're stopped! Easily gets right up to 70 quickly with plenty more to go, have to look out for cops! Am open to suggestions if anyone can think of any improvments to this set up.
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Post by fulltiltone on Jun 12, 2006 11:17:51 GMT -5
Which MRP Exhaust did you get? I'm having fits trying to get the 2R to run on a 150. Just purchased a 63mm Kit for mine, but haven't recieved it yet.
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Post by Admin on Jun 12, 2006 12:05:31 GMT -5
Sounds like a tight little set-up. The 155cc kit giving a little boost but no need to machine the crankcase. Fulltilt, if you are going to install the 63mm kit, keep the 2R exhaust. Did you get my email?
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Post by fulltiltone on Jun 12, 2006 19:08:53 GMT -5
I got the e-mail, I had planned to upgrade to the 170 but got a good deal on a 180 instead. I checked the manifold for leaks, didn't find one but really didn't expect to. Manifold leaks, cracks and the like really show themselves at idle unless you have a great big gaping hole. I just figured I can't return the 2R and if I get the V150 exhaust I'll just have the 2@ and it's intrinsic value sitting on a shelf. Later when I would upgrade to the 170 or 180 I would have the V150 sitting on the shelf and lets face it used scooter parts don't have much value. I have a machinist friend who will do the work for me gratis, so I just have to figure out if it's just the case or a combination of case and skirt.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 12, 2006 19:45:16 GMT -5
Exhaust was around $269.00. I purchased it from NSB scooters in New Smyrna Beach Fl. (he got it from MRP). I am not sure which model it is but it is chrome and came complete with the header pipe and there were no springs involved, it just slipped on to the header pipe. It is just like the one featured on this site on the exhaust mounting page instruction.
Out of all the parts I iinvested in, the camshaft did the most for me. I installed it very last after months of installing part by part. The exhaust did very little as did the carb, until the camshaft was put in. The next most valuable part was the oversized valve head. I spent alot of time messing around with variator weights and that also did very little. It was the totality of these parts that did the trick not just any one part or the other (THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT ADVICE!). If you think a pipe and or a carb is going to give you more power, it will, but very incrementally. My message here is that you really need the camshaft to open the valves more to pump more air in and out of your head as well as the ported valve head, and the carb to deliver more fuel, and the pipe to be able to get the added air out. Most of the other performance parts are just enhancing this effect.
I have a spare engine all stock, broken in just right sitting in its crate that I bought on ebay for 300 bucks so if I ever wanted to I could go back to a stock engine at any time so I won't have any down time if my race engine ever breaks. This almost got me to have it machined, but I decided not to at this time, now I'm glad I didn't because what I have is plenty enough. I didn't want to have to rely on a machine shop as well as have to take the entire engine apart to get a bigger cylinder kit. Also it is of my opinion that there isn't alot of meat where the bigger cylinder goes into the engine block. I was advised a long time ago if I did install a 175 cc kit, that the machinist should take the metal down 50/50 cylinder outer surface and engine block opening. All he would have to do is screw up on the engine block and guess what- you are now out of an engine block.
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Post by fulltiltone on Jun 12, 2006 20:13:13 GMT -5
was your pipe the oval or round body. The round is the V150, the oval is the 2R.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 12, 2006 20:33:47 GMT -5
It was definitly the round 150 type. I asked for that one because I always had intentions of using the 155cc kit. Very louder now that new camshaft was put in. Sounds like a Ducati. Was very difficult to get the clamps just right so it held together with the header pipe.
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Post by surfbum96818 on Jun 12, 2006 22:37:54 GMT -5
I just wanted to ask you a few questions; first I have been planning on buying an MRP 150 best power pack it takes it to 155cc has cyl, exhaust, carb, clutch, vari, intake manifold, torque spring, timing chain, AND cam shaft, best price I have found so far is around $680.00 now as mentioned this includes the pipe so that right there is about $300.00 right ? and you said this along with modified air filter, no rev limit ignition and racing spark plug wires is your set up? What type of ignition did you use and how much was it. Did you have to order you spark plug wires or were you able to find them locally? Have you changed out your fuel lines ? and do you plan to?
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Post by limeracer on Jun 13, 2006 7:21:11 GMT -5
I spent alot more then the 680 bucks it costs for the package deal BUT I was able to nickel and dime it piece by piece over 6 months. The biggest cost was the pipe(just under $300) and the next was the carb (just under $200). Many of the parts I bought were on ebay because I sell a product on ebay (my invention called circuitsiren) and the monies go into my paypal account and its like free money because the units are given to my by my company. So I bought the cheap black CDI (unlimited rev) unit for like $17.00 and change, the racing variator and valve head on ebay. Valve head was a pain because it took a long time to receive and I had to sign for it and had to chase it down at the post office but that's another story. Cap and wire came from Gino's PR, who provides performance parts in a good professional manner with fast shipping. The race variator came from ebay as well as the clutch springs and race clutch. The pipe, cylinder kit, camshaft , clutch spring, and the carb came from my local scooter dealer who also has a link on this site- NSB scooters. This was mainly because you have to be a scooter dealer to purchase parts from MRP and I was able to pick the parts up directly with no shipping charges.
I don't plan on changing fuel lines anytime soon. They look fine to me anyway if I ever saw a crack, a leak or anything that would get my attention regarding them I would change them. I constantly look for things to improve with my scooter but I didn't find the need to change my fuel lines at this time. I removed the nuts from my under seat storage bin so I can inspect my engine constantly. If you are going to make improvments on your engine, that seems to save alot of time and effort. Its not like its going to fall out while riding or anything.
If I had to do it over again, I would have bought the whole package from MRP, but there were advantages for me to install things piece by piece. If you were to install that whole package at once and had a problem, you may not know what part is causing it. Also my wife would have had my head if I spent that much $$ all at once.
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Post by Admin on Jun 13, 2006 7:25:50 GMT -5
Hey Lime, which camshaft did you install? I've got an A9 from MRP sitting on a shelf that I need to get around to doing something with. They have two or three available but couldn't tell me the differences.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 13, 2006 7:34:10 GMT -5
Stock air box took up too much engine work space. I was very happy the day I got rid of it. Living in the hot climate of Florida, it also lets the heat out of the engine better. After riding, I leave the seat up and the heat rises right out of the engine compartment with the stock airbox gone. I also leave my front engine inspection door off year round. It allows much better air flow over the valve cover without it. Make no mistake, when you performance part your engine out, it does heat up slightly more and you need to do all you can for better cooling.
Bought one of those high RPM racing fans and only install it in cooler weather. This time of year I go back to the stock fan because at idle, as if you were sitting at a red light, you can feel like 10 times the air flow with the stock fan. I am not really a fan of the race fan. I didn't feel any performance difference whatsoever with it, but I did feel much less air flow. I think they are more show-and-tell than effective, but that's just my opinion. I'm sure someone else will refute that statement.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 13, 2006 7:36:22 GMT -5
Dawg: I asked for the next one up from stock. My local dealer told me that the stock was an A8 so he sold me an A9. I am not sure if this is true, I have a feeling that an A8 is one up from the stock, but I used the A9 and it kicks butt.
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Post by Admin on Jun 13, 2006 12:31:42 GMT -5
Cool, that's what I have. I'm assuming you can use it with a stock head and valve clearances are the same. Maybe I shouldn't make those assumptions.
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Post by surfbum96818 on Jun 13, 2006 16:55:34 GMT -5
thanks for the info lime! I can't wait to get the news as to whether or not I can tear into my current scoot.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 13, 2006 17:34:47 GMT -5
Dawg: I wouldn't waste another minute. It will be well worth the effort to install the A9 camshaft. I did pull the engine to do it mainly because you have to remove the chain tensioner and that is too tough to get to as well as taking off the plastic shroud. Also it was a good time to check for oil leaks and do some cleaning while engine is on the bench. You will obviously have to re-adjust the valve clearances when you are done but I would say it will work just fine with the stock head. The so called big bore head I have actually has the same valve sizes both in diameter and in height. The difference is that the intake and exhaust outside openings are much larger as well as the port areas inside the openings- like night and day with the stock. I bought my head from someone on ebay. He wanted like 80 bucks and 40 for shipping but accepted a "best offer" of 55 bucks with 40 shipping. What the heck, scooter costs 1200, shipping 300 more, and performance parts 600-800, so whats another 100 bucks for a ported head? I'm sure though that the difference is only incremental to the stock head anyway but I wanted to get every ounce of speed and performance for my already spent dollars.
Geez I could have had a brand new Ninja 250 for what I paid for my set up. They are just under 3 grand brand new. I needed and wanted the comfort of a scooter though and am very happy with what I have now. I had a ninja ZX6R and was very uncomfortable (45 minutes was about all I could take) and was followed by the cops and had all kinds of trouble in the past like getting caught for going over 100MPH- way too tempting. Now my scooter is more comfortable than my living room couch and I can ride it all day long and still feel good when I get back home.
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Post by Admin on Jun 13, 2006 23:02:06 GMT -5
Thanks for the info, Lime. I've never found the chain tensioner to be that hard to deal with, even with the engine still on the frame. I tried to get this info from MRP. Where are you getting yours? (knowledge, that is).
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Post by limeracer on Jun 14, 2006 7:27:40 GMT -5
I don't like taking the side and under seat plastics off. For me, since I am well set up, its easier to remove entire engine. Only takes me 20 minutes. Actually takes me longer to remove the plastic. One of my secrets to removing the engine quickly is that I use a Ryobi 18 volt cordless impact gun. It has quick release chuck and I have quarter inch and 3/8" inch socket adapters. As you know you only really need 8mm, 10mm, 12mm, 14mm sockets to remove the engine. Once you do it a few times, you get really fast at it. I also use a floor jack and a small board to support the engine while removing the main support bolt. This allows me to do it comfortably all by myself. I also remove the back wheel nut with a 1/2" corded electric impact drill and the appropriate 1/2" inch drive socket. When the wheel is off that's also a good time to clean it and the engine on a workbench.
I gained my knowledge of all this by studying the parts on the internet extensively, also studying my service manual, but most of all I had problems with my engine when it was new last year whereby I took it for long hard rides in the hot Florida sun and I ended up warping the cylinder as well as dealing with a broken exhaust stud. I received a warranty head and had to convert the valves back into the new head. I took the engine apart and didn't realize to take note of the marks on the camshaft nor that fact that there was a cam tensioner and what its function was. It was then that I purchased the manual, then I was able to reason it all out part for part. Now I know the entire top end like the back of may hand. I have had it apart and back together over 10 times (each time removing the entire engine), replacing various parts for repairs and for performance upgrades piece by piece and taking note of the differences part for part. That was the advantage of not buying a performance part package and doing it the way I did. It really gets you to appreciate what you are doing and also spreads out the fun of doing it, while mastering every nut and bolt on your scooter. I certainly don't have to bring my scooter in to a shop and be at their mercy and it gives me something fun and pleasurable to do on Sunday mornings besides riding. I forewarn the novice mechanic that thinks he can replace his top end. The bottom gasket sometimes isn't cut right and blocks the oil passages. This caused me alot of problems with another top end. There are alot of sensitive issues with these kits. I can't stress enough you have to take your time and really check out each part you are replacing. Once you go forward and put your valve cover on, you don't want to have to go backwards and redo steps that were done wrong.
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Post by knice on Jun 14, 2006 7:47:58 GMT -5
How did you find the service at NSB scooters? I must have called and emailed that guy a dozen times to buy MRP parts and he NEVER replied to any of my querries. Did you just go in there? I'm up in St. Augustine, so I didn't want to drive all that way without talking to the guy first. What service manual do you have?
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Post by limeracer on Jun 14, 2006 7:52:58 GMT -5
cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GY6-150cc-A8-Camshaft-Vento-Clones-Scooter-ATVs_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ84149QQihZ002QQitemZ4648215596QQrdZ1If you look at this link, this seller claims that the A8 is a high performance camshaft, therefore the A9 must open the valves deeper and that would re-inforce my earlier claim that the A9 is two sizes up vs. the stock. You can actually see in his picture the depth of the A8 vs. the stock camshaft. The A9 to me would then open the valves 1mm deeper. Dawg: I would recommend if you are going to use the stock head and the A9 camshaft- to test first by using your kick starter and turning a few revolutions by hand before you close up your engine. I have not verified that my oversized head valves are the same height as stock. I think they are but am not certain. If you bench check and they bottom out, at least you shouldn't damage anything and can reconvert easily. If you don't test first, then you could potentially damage your engine and I wouldn't want that on my conscience. I don't think Gino would sell a camshaft that couldn't be used on a stock head nor was I advised of this either but I just want you to make sure before you close up your engine. Don't ever assume. Thanks
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Post by limeracer on Jun 14, 2006 7:58:41 GMT -5
its ebay item # 4648215596
Just go to ebay and insert this number in the search box
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Post by Admin on Jun 14, 2006 8:28:56 GMT -5
I'm just going from memory (but I'm an old man) but I did check the rise of the A9 cam against stock. If memory is serving, the rise of the cam was the same or just slightly more. It was the angle of the cams that was the major difference. It appeared to be shaped to leave the valves open a little longer. Probably just a readjustment of valve lash would cover any potential problems and a bench check just by turning the magneto by hand would reveal potential problems. I've got too many scooters in the shed anyway, should disaster strike.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 14, 2006 18:57:26 GMT -5
Yes knice; I consider Larry at NSB a good friend as well as my local dealer. If you call him on the phone I am sure he will take care of your MRP needs. call FUN 428-5800. I only dealt with him a couple of times but when I asked him to fulfill my list he did on my word alone- no credit card info was asked for until it was time to pay at time of pickup. I went there one saturday afternoon and we discussed scooter mechanics for hours. When I went back we discussed it for a couple hours again. I was actually going to copy and paste some of the stuff I have been discussing here in this forum because he wanted to know the outcome of all these parts I was buying and installing. I actually learned several things from him as well as shared some of my knowledge and tips. It shocks me to hear that he didn't respond to you. I live an hour away from him and visiting his shop was well worth the drive. My advice is to give him another try, but use the phone this time. There was a mis spell in his web site email and I brought it to his attention so maybe that was the problem.
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Post by knice on Jun 14, 2006 19:26:35 GMT -5
Thanks for your input LimeRacer. Now I know that I will drive down there.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 15, 2006 7:07:12 GMT -5
He closes at like 4pm on Saturdays. I just assumed he was open till 5. I got there at 10 after 4 and thank God he was still there and he let me in to pay for my pipe. If you do end up doing bus. with him tell him Rick from Orlando says hello. Thanks
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Post by lewtwo on Jun 15, 2006 21:09:13 GMT -5
Question One: HEY Lime .... What kind of mileage do you get with that setup ??
Question two: >> The so called big bore head I have actually has the same valve sizes both in diameter and in height. The difference is that the intake and exhaust outside openings are much larger as well as the port areas inside the openings- like night and day with the stock. <<
Is the difference within the range of porting and polishing or do you think there are majoe differences in the casting ?
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Post by Admin on Jun 15, 2006 22:51:44 GMT -5
Not to get too far off topic, but lime, what happened to your avatar?
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Post by limeracer on Jun 16, 2006 7:43:41 GMT -5
Apparently my web site is having problems. I think its a hosting co. issue. PHP Nuke site- sometimes there are issues like this.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 16, 2006 7:52:15 GMT -5
lewtwo: I don't think I get good gas mileage at all now, but I never actually recorded it before or after. I just put my gallon and a half in every week or two depending on how much I ride. Either way gas mileage is the least of my worries. I would much rather have the power to pass cars easily than to have my scooter in its stock form.
The head is totally different than the stock. I don't know if it is recasted or not, but the opeining sizes where the intake pipe goes in and the exhaust comes out is much bigger in diameter also when you look inside those opeings there is much greater area hollowed out as opposed to the stock. It is also a smoother metal surface than the stock. Stock seesm to have alot of lumps and bumps in the inside metal. I did notice a huge difference in power when I installed the larger head, but it really came to life after I installed the A9 camshaft. Between the head and the camshaft, that accounts for 80% of my additional power over stock, all other parts account for like 20%. That's why I say it is well worth the $$.
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Post by fulltilt1 on Jun 16, 2006 9:31:32 GMT -5
Why the decision for the A9 camshaft? I emailed Joel Martin about the A11 (Race) and he said the MRPV150 was there most popular. He rated about an A10 to 10.5 in the grand scheme of things. He was quick to confirm to me that it's usually a package not a part that really wakes things up.
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Post by limeracer on Jun 18, 2006 9:09:00 GMT -5
High performance camshaft adds stress and additional heat to the engine. You can hear the valves slapping a little more when they seat and additional heat is very apparent. There is no "wonder part" in this game. Added performance definitely comes from the totality of high performance parts. I noticed a dramatic increase in performance when I installed the A9 camshaft but I installed camshaft last after all other performance mods. A9 was recommended to me by my local MRP dealer because I asked for one size up from stock. I didn't find the need to add more stress and especially heat to my engine living in one of the hottest climates in the US. Part of my mesage was that variator weights, pipe, and carb. alone didn't do very much for my top speed as opposed to ported head with larger intake and exhaust openings combined with high performance camshaft. I just didn't want people to think that if they buy a pipe, that they would be experiencing breath taking speed increases. The performance statistics on this web site regarding exhaust systems are accurate. You will add a couple of MPH if you add a pipe. I went from 55-60 mph with all mods except camshaft to almost 80 MPH (I have still never flat out floored it) with the completion of the camshaft change. I don't really need to go any faster. I have heard from my local dealer that there are racers in New Jersey that race scooters with GY6 engines that are getting 120 MPH out of their bikes. His questions arose just like mine- is the frame and wheel set really rated for those speeds? Where would you go that fast? Geez, I ride on 45 MPH roads. One of the reasons why I own and ride a scooter is because I got into alot of trouble on a ninja. I didn't want the temptation of being able to go 150MPH like I found myself doing alot. Now I am able to go 80 on a 45 MPH road, which is also pushing things. I was definitely frustrated not being able to pass a slow car which now I am not worried about any more. Sometimes you need to be able to get out of harms way via more speed and power. It is nice to have. Stock bike was just too slow for me.
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