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Post by chaz12 on Nov 28, 2012 16:00:59 GMT -5
;D Rode from Belle MO to Holts Summit MO last week. It was easier than I thought. I mean, when riding 40 mph and running into a big gust of wind from a truck, well it felt like I was going to leave the road...lol When doing 70 mph, well the on coming traffic is divided by a concrete wall or a wide strip. So the gust of wind can't hit you... So all I had to worry about, is traffic moving in my direction which wasn't bad, because I never had many vehicle pass me on the 45 mile journey. 3 days later, I rode to Columbia and back to Holts Summit MO.. My rear brake pad is probably worn out by now. I use the rear brake more often to slow up, as the front. I will have to order the master cyllender, brake caliper, and pads.. Get here before Xmas.. Being the my Bali 250 does 70 mph still, I seriously doubt I need a belt and clutch.. Attachments:
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Post by skuttadawg on Nov 28, 2012 16:25:03 GMT -5
When you see a dump truck or semi let off of the throttle and hold on . For slowing down simply let up off the throttle for it as well . Brakes are for stooping
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Post by scootnwinn on Nov 28, 2012 22:59:09 GMT -5
Nice to see you enjoying the scoot.
You may consider changing your braking habits 70% of your braking force is in the front. The back brake is not as powerful and the time it takes to get on the front might be critical. Its best to use them both simultaneously...
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Post by rockynv on Nov 28, 2012 23:38:35 GMT -5
I can't remember if you have trouble with your right hand. If you do one option would be, if the master cylinders are equal, to swap the rear brake lines to the right hand and the front to the left. The front brake really provides 60% to 80% of the total stopping power of the bike.
Myself I just play on through with the trucks, etc however my bike is a tad more aerodynamic than the Bali and takes 15" Sport Bike or Metric Cruiser tires. Pirelli MT66 or Sava MC28 Diamonds. I feel a little pressure and little wiggle but trucks comming in the opposite direction don't really do much to me. I also have a Puig Sport Fairing instead of the more typical windsheild which also helps. The trucks coming up from behind will usually stay behind since I keep up with the flow of traffic giving them no reason to pass.
I live in Florida and ride my Aprilia Sport City back after delivering motorhomes to campgrounds. Last August 2011 I got caught on my way back from Orlando to Tampa riding on I4 by Hurricane Irene so whats a few passing trucks compared to that. The wind did not slow me down and it was a very stable 75 to 80 (gps) mph until I started entering Tampa where the speed limit starts dropping to 50/55.
Learn to relax without going overboard and it will become a reflex dealing with other traffic. What you do need to watch out for is crosswinds that hit you when coming out from behind barriers that block them from the roadway. Where there are noise abatement barriers and when coming out from underpasses you can suddenly be exposed to a constant 25mph or greater cross wind however if you get used to watching the trees and other vehicles ahead of you for the signs of a cross winds presence you learn to be prepared and automatically adjust your balance to compensate. Even riding along side a large truck (it is called the dead zone for a many reasons) can block a cross wind so you need to be prepared to cope with one when the truck separates from your vicinity.
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Post by jlee on Nov 28, 2012 23:45:23 GMT -5
Learn to relax without going overboard and it will become a reflex dealing with other traffic. What you do need to watch out for is crosswinds that hit you when coming out from behind barriers that block them from the roadway. Where there are noise abatement barriers and when coming out from underpasses you can suddenly be exposed to a constant 25mph or greater cross wind howevwe if you get used to watching the trees and other vehicles ahead of you for the signs of a cross winds presence you learn to be prepared and automatically adjust your balance to compensate. Even riding along side a large truck can block a cross wind so you need to be prepared to cope with one when the truck separates from your vicinity. Good to see some advice worth reading.  |
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Post by spandi on Nov 29, 2012 0:15:37 GMT -5
Being on the highway isn't as bad as a lot of people say it is, I just stay on the right and keep up with traffic. BTW, if you haven't done so already, you might want to swap out the standard Chinese tires (usually J rated for up to 62mph) for a set of Michelin or Pirelli tires (S rated to 94mph) and a much better ride than the stock stuff.
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Post by rockynv on Nov 29, 2012 12:55:06 GMT -5
Being on the highway isn't as bad as a lot of people say it is, I just stay on the right and keep up with traffic. BTW, if you haven't done so already, you might want to swap out the standard Chinese tires (usually J rated for up to 62mph) for a set of Michelin or Pirelli tires (S rated to 94mph) and a much better ride than the stock stuff. The Pirelli Metric Cruiser rear tire worked out well for me. It was a hybrid sport/cruiser tread that works well on Florida roads. The Sava (from GoodYears factory in Slovinia) are decent also as are the Michelins. The Michelin Power Pure were a consideration for me but around here many claim that they do not last very long. |
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Post by chaz12 on Nov 29, 2012 13:52:52 GMT -5
I had a severe stroke at age 16 that paralyzed my right side. I am 48 years old today and can rotated the throttle with my right hand but can't always grab the right brake lever. This is why I use the left brake more often in stopping. Left brake is the rear brake lever.. Still looking for away to function both brakes with the left hand.. I do it fairly safe though, in only braking with my right hand. In braking using the rear brake only I concentrate on traffic conditions, put space between me and other drivers, look for safest hours to ride, ect.. Like the hours between 9:00 a.m to 11:00 a.m. are fairly safe because most people are at work or in school. 1:00 pm to 4:00 pm most are at work or in school. My scooter length is 8 feet approx and when following, I try to give 1 car length 16 ft per 10 mph.. This is how I got 6000 miles on my scooter.
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Post by jlee on Nov 29, 2012 14:00:45 GMT -5
I had a severe stroke at age 16 that paralyzed my right side. I am 48 years old today and can rotated the throttle with my right hand but can't always grab the right brake lever. This is why I use the left brake more often in stopping. Left brake is the rear brake lever.. Still looking for away to function both brakes with the left hand.. I do it fairly safe though, in only braking with my right hand. In braking using the rear brake only I concentrate on traffic conditions, put space between me and other drivers, look for safest hours to ride, ect.. Like the hours between 9:00 a.m to 11:00 a.m. are fairly safe because most people are at work or in school. 1:00 pm to 4:00 pm most are at work or in school. My scooter length is 8 feet approx and when following, I try to give 1 car length 16 ft per 10 mph.. This is how I got 6000 miles on my scooter. Glad you are able to ride! You may want to consider swapping the right and left brake levers, as the front brake is definitely the one you need to grab in an emergency (most of the time). |
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Post by scootnwinn on Nov 29, 2012 15:14:32 GMT -5
Might also look into a linked brake system. its a simple valve that makes it to were you are using both in a proportionally good way. Its just a valve and a y fitting basically (yes I know its a bit more complicated than that). And should be easy to add with a bit of brake line
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Post by chaz12 on Nov 29, 2012 15:54:30 GMT -5
Switching sides would be sort of easy. I am riding tomorrow another 200 mile round trip. What I will do after this ride, is order a new back brake system( $120) Switch the front brake to left side and put the new rear brake system on the right side.
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Post by ridecheap on Nov 29, 2012 17:18:18 GMT -5
I drove from Milwaukee to Madison WI on the Interstate when I first bought my scooter. The wind from the trucks would push you over the side once they go by. Yeah its normal but adding some weight will help.
I switched out stock rollers for Dr Pully Sliders in the variator major difference the engine is pushing more HP on the highway easy 70 mph steady not topped out like before. You might want to try this for Xmas.
Break pads easy to swap out and find for cheap. Sounds like fun you had.
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Post by spandi on Nov 29, 2012 18:39:50 GMT -5
I drove from Milwaukee to Madison WI on the Interstate when I first bought my scooter. The wind from the trucks would push you over the side once they go by. Yeah its normal but adding some weight will help. I switched out stock rollers for Dr Pully Sliders in the variator major difference the engine is pushing more HP on the highway easy 70 mph steady not topped out like before. You might want to try this for Xmas. Break pads easy to swap out and find for cheap. Sounds like fun you had. Hey ridecheap, what was the weight of the replacement sliders? Update: Never mind, I saw it listed on your video. |
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Post by lovemy2strokes on Nov 29, 2012 20:15:03 GMT -5
Hiya in Belle, My cousin lives down there. A lot of towns where the speed limit drops very quickly in between 60-70 mph speed limits. Good for the local economy, bad for the un watching motorist. I bet it had to be a beautiful ride.
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Post by chaz12 on Nov 29, 2012 20:43:00 GMT -5
Ya, what makes me laugh, is the price I paid for my ride, verses cars on 70 mph freeways. I am sure, I get better gas milage- 60 to 70 mpg.. I think, Drivers must think," What the heck.. that little scooter is keeping up with me.. what the.... That is the craziest thing.. I paid $1700 new in the crate and others pay $16,000 to $24,000 for their rides. Harleys cost a mint too. Harley riders always wave at me. You would not realize my scoot is a cheapy and think it is made by Honda selling for $6,000... Just like most people that see a MC54 B think it is a Honda Reflex. A Harley rider asked what kind of scooter is it. Saying even Harley parts are made in China today.. So no body really cares about it being a cheapy.. But I take as many back road highways usually. Funny to ride and be less traffic. I was forced to ride from Belle MO to Holts Summit MO on 55, 60, 65, 70 mph highways. Usually I would find a alternate route, but in this case, there was no alternate route since crossing the Missouri River is Jefferson City MO... On my 200 mile round trip, there is back routes to go 55 mph.. The only reason I like these routes still, is 70 mph highways are fun but I can not go faster if needed. 55 mph highways I still have a little more throttle if needed to get out of danger. But riding 70 mph is fun and after looking at the speed for a while, it appears slower than it really is. I mean, you crash at that speed and your body is going to slide 200 to 300 ft on pavement. Been riding scoots since 1992.. I bought a full face helmet, leather jacket, leather gloves, boots, jeans.. Never crashed yet..
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Post by jlee on Nov 30, 2012 0:54:21 GMT -5
Even on my motorcycle which can easily exceed 130mph, I prefer the slower back roads when possible. I like to sightsee, and high speed highways are boring (to me).
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Post by prodigit on Nov 30, 2012 1:04:28 GMT -5
Depends, if the scenery changes or not.
Going through the everglades at sunset is wonderful!
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Post by larrball on Nov 30, 2012 2:10:10 GMT -5
Ride safe my friend, and if ya get this before ya leave..
Stop on by before 2pm
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Post by jwalz1 on Nov 30, 2012 11:02:29 GMT -5
Hey Chaz,
Glad to hear you are having fun on some long distance rides. I am not sure what kind of back roads you are taking, I ride some out here that are pretty much in the woods with real tall trees, lots of shade and some fairly short field-of-view corners sometimes.
If this is any of the kind of stuff you ride and like to modify the scoot at all I really suggest a headlight modulator. It basically hooks to the brights generally, and you may normally ride with the regular headlights on, but when you get into some tree lined back roads you switch to the brights and the modulator pulsates the headlight making you stick out like a sore thumb. It is really hard to be missed and adds some safety margin.
The first time I ever saw one on the road it was a guy on a goldwing trike and I noticed the guy from about twice the distance I normally would have picked him up at. Great for the dark shaded back road, especially if you have a dark colored bike.
Have fun
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Post by jlee on Nov 30, 2012 11:19:45 GMT -5
Just check the laws on modulators in Missouri and surrounding states. They're not legal everywhere.
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Post by mrnoitall on Nov 30, 2012 12:59:23 GMT -5
Nice to see you enjoying the scoot. You may consider changing your braking habits 70% of your braking force is in the front. The back brake is not as powerful and the time it takes to get on the front might be critical. Its best to use them both simultaneously... In the name of accuracy, The 70% rule is a general rule based on the mid-engine placement of sport bikes. Bikes with long wheelbases and a more rearward weight distribution (like cruisers) and especially most scooters with their rear mounted engines rely more heavily on their rear brakes. |
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Post by mrnoitall on Nov 30, 2012 13:26:39 GMT -5
Just check the laws on modulators in Missouri and surrounding states. They're not legal everywhere. Not much is legal anywhere any more. Heck the constitution says, and the courts have ruled that we have a right to travel using our own property without restriction on public roads and what do the states do? They restrict your travel by requiring a license. A license is permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal. If you had a license to kill ( intelligence officer etc) You are given permission to do something that is illegal (murder) to begin with. ...but in today's world, a license has been purposely redefined and misapplied in order to fool the people into believing they are required to get permission from some government authority to do something that is and always has been perfectly legal. A license is a restriction on your rights. You already have the right to operate your property on public roads that you paid for. Common law and commonsense says so and the constitution enforces it in writing. They have changed the constitutional right to travel from a right to a privilege and the vast majority of people are so easily manipulated that they actually believe the government should have the power to determine who can and cannot use their private property based on the fallacious "safety" argument. Yes I'm mad ;D By the way, There has been a very recent attempt to require bicyclists in NYC to be licensed. This is the wave of the future. You will need a license to ride a bike, to use your air conditioner and to buy food and gas and all of the lemons out there will accept the government's (rulers) argument that it's all about safety and protecting us from harm... All they have to do is say it's to protect the children or to protect the homeland from evil terrorists and the stupid serfs will accept their own enslavement with a smile. |
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Post by scootnwinn on Nov 30, 2012 15:34:13 GMT -5
Nice to see you enjoying the scoot. You may consider changing your braking habits 70% of your braking force is in the front. The back brake is not as powerful and the time it takes to get on the front might be critical. Its best to use them both simultaneously... In the name of accuracy, The 70% rule is a general rule based on the mid-engine placement of sport bikes. Bikes with long wheelbases and a more rearward weight distribution (like cruisers) and especially most scooters with their rear mounted engines rely more heavily on their rear brakes. I'm not saying that's accurate or inaccurate but how do explain the pronounced fork dive on both scooters and cruisers. It sure seems to me like the front tire gets loaded pretty quick when you brake. Where did you hear that I'd like to see the physics? I can see how the rear brake might be a bit better but it seems like the leading tire would still have the best chance at serious braking. not arguing with you I just would really like to know if it is true?? I know my Burgman's linked brake system proportions the force 30% front 70% back so the front wheel doesn't lock up and that the Gold Wing uses a similar ratio. You would think Suzuki had an engineer look at that...  |
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Post by jwalz1 on Nov 30, 2012 20:21:12 GMT -5
I realize scooters have SOME degree more weight towards the rear than most motor cycles, but I think some of the advice about staying off the front brake and relying on the rear is very misinformed, contrary to just about every motorcycle safety piece of information you can get your hands on and downright dangerous.
It is fine to "get by" with the rear brake in many situations. But when you need to stop hard because someone has just turned in front of you it is bad habits that can kill you.
And unless you are racing the damn thing you should be breaking BEFORE the corners, not midcorner. If you are breaking at midcorner, you generally went into it wrong.
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Post by scootnwinn on Nov 30, 2012 22:11:10 GMT -5
Thanks jwalz that helped me get this all clear in my head. It is true motorcycles and scooters are slightly different but just for a second lets assume the split is 50/50 why would you only use half your stopping power. I'm not saying only use your front I was saying use them both (or at least that's what I wanted to say). If you think your rear brake is better than the front try it out I doubt you can stop faster with the rear. I can't on either of my scooters and one has a linked system. The front brake shouldn't be used in a corner at least at extreme angles and a light rear is the answer until the bike is perpendicular to the road way. That being said you can wreck still using the rear incorrectly. They have a name for these wrecks, too much front in a corner is called high side generally too much rear, low side (really the front will send you either way but the rear will never send you high)
I watch scooter racing a lot and you can watch them all grab a whole mess of front brake when entering a corner at top speed. Why would they do that unless it was the most effective way? Use both your brakes, learn to use them effectively know their limits get a feel for when they will lock up they are most effective right before they lock up. Don't let fear dictate your braking habits (namely fear of front wheel locking up) skill should be the foundation of your riding habits. A tire starts to chirp just before it locks up BTW
Sorry to the OP for my part in the hijacking of of this thread...
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Post by sharks06lly on Dec 1, 2012 9:41:53 GMT -5
not using the front brake sounds like the dumbest idea i have ever heard.... idk maybe some people haven't taken a msc but idk why you say you can lock up the front brake easier? have you ever tried locking up the brakes on a bike? i have and the back is twice as easy to me to lock up then the front. i have ridden dirt bikes since i was little and even when riding them on the street i could lock up my rear and slide any time i wanted to. i have personally locked up a rear on my on my dads sportster when a guy pulled out in front of me and i pulled both brakes the same( how i was taught since i was 5). im sorry i dont mean to be rude with this but i feel like some newbie is going to get on here and read this and get killed by using one freaking brake
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Post by jwalz1 on Dec 1, 2012 13:21:02 GMT -5
not using the front brake sounds like the dumbest idea i have ever heard.... idk maybe some people haven't taken a msc Correct and you hit the nail on the head with the second part. Bad advice is going to get somebody hurt. |
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Post by jwalz1 on Dec 1, 2012 13:31:52 GMT -5
Brake full power with the rear, and front try to feel how hard you can brake without locking up the front wheel. It's easy to do that on dry ground, but when wet, the wheel locks up faster than thought! (believe me, I've been there, and was glad I had ABS on the bike). Prodigit, Answer one question: how does your BMS 260 both lock up the front wheel easy and have ABS at the same time? It's not ABS, its a bleeder valve. Secondly relying on the rear brake and getting into a rear brake lockup can be less dangerous, if the person has been trained how to get out of it or stick with the rear wheel slide and possible "low side". Letting go of the rear brake during a slide and the rear wheel gaining traction again quickly can cause a "high side". Watch some high side videos. Riders who high side many times are thrown from the bike down onto their heads. For helmet wearers they may get lucky, for non helmet people it can be death or fifty years in a wheel chair with a drool bib because the were not using simple braking technique, or braking in corners without the experience to do so correctly. You avoided someones question earlier about whether or not you have taken the safety course. If you have not, please do not give out advice on proper technique backed up by "I would think just the opposite". The techniques in the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course and in books like Proficient Motorcycling are proven and developed by people with data, research and millions of miles of motorcycling experience. A few things I thought might be correct going in to the course proved not to be true. I am glad I was shown the correct way. The course is fun even if remedial for many and worth the money and time. |
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Post by jlee on Dec 1, 2012 13:32:20 GMT -5
not using the front brake sounds like the dumbest idea i have ever heard.... idk maybe some people haven't taken a msc Correct and you hit the nail on the head with the second part. Bad advice is going to get somebody hurt. Agreed - all this dreamed up theory doesn't change the fact that the front brake on ANY two-wheeled vehicle has significantly more stopping power than the rear. |
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Post by jwalz1 on Dec 1, 2012 13:42:21 GMT -5
Correct and you hit the nail on the head with the second part. Bad advice is going to get somebody hurt. Agreed - all this dreamed up theory doesn't change the fact that the front brake on ANY two-wheeled vehicle has significantly more stopping power than the rear. I think the huge part that is being missed is that even rear braking will compress the front fork. What this should tell you is the weight of the bike is moving forward. The bike is ditributing its weight forward just like a car would. Continuing on the rear brake, as the rear gets lighter, can lead to lockup, but also in an emergency avoiding the front brake either by choice or by bad habit loses most of your stopping power as all the traction is going to the front wheel. If you avoid or lightly use the front brake in a panic stop, the distance increases dramatically. A few feet can be the difference from plowing into the side of a left turning van or missing it entirely. The physics are all explained very clearly in Proficient Motorcycling to a degree better than in the MSC. I was very glad people on this board recommended the book and glad I read it. I was all too relying too much on the rear before. So much so I kept locking the rear during panic stops in the course until they corrected me. Easier to do with your weight on a foot brake though. The book is about $20 on Amazon. |
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