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Post by fairweasel2323 on May 20, 2012 3:06:07 GMT -5
Seafoam, 1oz per gallon of gas, will keep things clean. Over 3 years never had to clean my carb, just adjust the Fuel Ratio Mixture for temp changes. Wile I heard sea foam good but also Sta- Bil Fuel Stabilizer I used it since I had my carb cleaned its seemed to have helped |
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Post by fairweasel2323 on May 20, 2012 3:14:00 GMT -5
ok, So here is the latest. Hubby and I took the bike out today. Started up just fine, but sounded a bit slow to me on the idle. Nevertheless, we went, topped if off with gas and went for a ride setting the trip meter before leaving. 21 k's later, the bike just quits on me. We got it started, but it sounded really low in idle again. We went about 5 or yards and boom.....just quit on me again while riding through a very crowed parking lot with lots of cars and people. Chris was ahead of me both times since I didn't know my way through the park. We finally had to have it towed. The dealer refused to give us a refund and return our trade-in. He said they needed to send it back to the distributor who we got on the phone and complained to and we said that the bike has never run properly. He told the mechanic to bring it back to him and they would do the work on it. He says he has gone as far as he can go with what they trained him to do. He rode it around a few times and it went just fine; even though we had just had it towed in. THEN, I said..." you need to ride it at about 20-30-k's and then let it idle for a minute. He did. It stalled. He tried to start it and it wouldn't until the 4th try. then he says "well, it seems to be fine now"....What a joke! And by the way, he refused to pay the tow on it as well. Good thing the towing company said they owed my husband a favor, so they waived the cost. (privately). I asked for a loaner bike; they refused. I told him they need to give me another bike or they need to give me my money back. They said they could not refund the money. Then went on to tell me that they didn't make any money on the sale. AND that they didn't get paid from their higher ups for the service and time that they put into working on it. Now, from where I'm sitting....the bike is under warranty. NOT MY PROBLEM IF THEY AGREED TO WORK FOR FREE! I asked my husband if he signed something that waived a refund. He had not. I said again, clearly something is wrong. The mechanic(s) agreed, but said there was nothing else they could do. Now, remember...we gave him the bike this past Tuesday and it wasn't ready umtil yesterday. He told us it was fine. He drove it for 10 k's. I told him the problem is when you are starting or slowing down. It just abruptly shuts off. Now, we had to leave it with them again. It's a holiday weekend here in Canada. So, it's sitting until next Wednesday to go to another city where the distributor is to be tested by THEIR mechanic. Who knows when it will come back. They have my money and my bike. I did take a video of us trying to start it, where we were, us trying to start it several more times before the tow truck guy started putting it up on the rack. I'm thinking small claims court. I'm digusted. I'm soooo done. So sorry just read, was kinda skeptic of ur Dealer from first post most that offer those two and three year warranties i watch out for. I got a 15 day and 30 Day on electrical at a Family run business on mine, too many company's doing bad business and thats some BS! they made money on it that's there JOB! I wish u GOOD LUCK SUING THEM! |
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Post by ScooterChick on May 20, 2012 22:05:43 GMT -5
I will update once I get the sick thing back. I'm sure there will be the same if not different issues. What can you expect I guess when there are most likely kids putting these things together in sweat shops.....
sheesh.....what a mess! Buyer .....BEWARE!
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Post by ScooterChick on May 21, 2012 9:18:26 GMT -5
Well, my Kymco 50cc Vitality had a 2 year warranty and it ran just fine. We had to replace the spark plug once. But other than that, the mechanic who was also the dealer was very good at his job. The only reason I didn't stay with him was because he didn't want to sell the bike we wanted for a reasonable price on a trade in. He wanted almost full price, plus my scooter which I purchased from him with just over 1000 k's on it. So, we looked else where. Also, I wanted to upgrade to a 250 and Kymco was not shipping anymore 250's to Canada.
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Post by wile on May 21, 2012 11:43:28 GMT -5
Canada!! I thought you were from around Tampa Area, Clearwater ;D  Wile |
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Post by ScooterChick on May 21, 2012 23:21:02 GMT -5
Nope. British Columbia, Canada...ha. I have never lived in Florida and my husband has lived in Canada all of his life. I'm American. So, I know for a fact that the market and choices there are far larger than here.
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Post by ScooterChick on May 26, 2012 16:37:14 GMT -5
After having the bike out of the shop for the 4th time for one day only, it was sent to the Saga Canada distributor last Wednesday in Langley, BC. We called them ourselves this morning to find out what exactly was being done to the bike or had been done. The person who was at the front counter refused to let us speak to the mechanic that worked on the bike there in Langely. The first thing he said to us after we identified ourselves was that he didn't ever want to see that bike back in his shop again. Then he went on to tell us that bad gas had been run through the bike. We told him about the gauge reading empty and when we went to fill it up it only took a gallon. We don't know what they had in it before we bought it. But it only had 19 k's on it when we purchased it. We went on to tell him that we have only filled it twice and both times we used 91 just as we were instructed.
He said it was almost ready and that when they got the bike and started it, that it started right up; which is the same thing the other guy said in Squamish. Then he told us that they had put 10 hours into servicing the bike. We asked exactly what was done to it?? He said he didn't have time to speak to us because he had customers that were walking out of the store. He also said that there were things that "should have been done" to the bike that were not done. My husband asked him what were they and who should have done them....he referred us back to the guy in Squamish and said "I don't know the guy, but I hear he is a pretty decent mechanic." So, the buck got passed once again to the dealer we purchased it from in Squamish.
We asked him about the "never wanting to see the bike in his shop again" comment and mentioned the 2 year warranty to him. He went on to tell us that the bike doesn't have a warranty! That one cannot be added now, and that it has to be purchased at the time the bike is registered. WE WERE SHOCKED! Seeing as the website clearly says that ALL their bikes come with a 2 year limited warranty. He said you have to "purchase" the warranty and that there was nothing in the records showing where we did. We told him there was nothing on the website that even "implied" we had to purchase it and that we had printed it out. Keep in mind that when we purchased the bike, the dealer in Squamish (Jamie) signed and dated the warranty paper and added the affective date of the warranty. So, to be told that we do not have one is .....well..suspect.
So, we asked again, about speaking to the mechanic who actually did the work. "he's too busy to speak to you and we don't speak to customers!" You need to speak to "Jamie" He should know all of this.! So, we are not wondering if the bike "started right up" then what was the 10 hours spent doing?? We could not get an answer from them. Everybody is passing the buck to the guy in Squamish, and he is blaming them for not telling him everything he needs to know.
This is the absolute worst customer service I have ever experienced. Nobody wants to take responsibility for selling us a bike that does not run properly. The bike has spent more time "getting adjustments" then I have been able to acutally ride it. I have taken it out three times since I had it and had to take it back each time because it stalled either when I was in traffic (rolling on the highway) or when decelerating to a stop.
I told this to the guy in Langley and said..."I could have been killed! This is dangerous!"...His response..."well, I know it is. Sure it is, but I really have to go now. I have already had two customer walk out."
The bike is supposed to be back in Squamish Monday afternoon. We we asked by "Jamie" to call first Tuesday morning to make sure that it was in fact there before we came to pick it up.
what a mess. Chinese bike or not. Nobody should do business like this with their customers. My husband and I happen to be business owners in the lower mainland. We pride ourselves in good customer service as we know that your customers are the people who keep food on your table! The guys were only concerned about how much "time" THEY had put into repairs; which from our perspective have been less than acceptable as we have to keep taking the bike back for the same issue.
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Post by ScooterChick on May 29, 2012 20:50:09 GMT -5
There is a glimmer of hope yet. We just had a good conversation with the dealer who has assured us that he has our best interest at heart and will do everything he can to get the bike running. Yes, it stalled again before we even took it off the lift...TWICE and he had trouble getting it restarted. He told us that the last thing he wants to see is one of his customers getting injured.
So, failing anyone being able to get this figured out, He has agreed to give us our trade in back and our money. All we want is the bike fixed. I think that is all EVERYONE wants at this point. It is a mystery why this thing is so temperamental. Nevertheless it is unsafe and if it cannot be repaired, we are just happy that he has in fact agreed to refund us our trade in and money back and that there hasn't been any loss of life or limb.
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Post by ScooterChick on May 30, 2012 10:28:39 GMT -5
ok, So here is the latest. Hubby and I took the bike out today. Started up just fine, but sounded a bit slow to me on the idle. Nevertheless, we went, topped if off with gas and went for a ride setting the trip meter before leaving. 21 k's later, the bike just quits on me. We got it started, but it sounded really low in idle again. We went about 5 or yards and boom.....just quit on me again while riding through a very crowed parking lot with lots of cars and people. Chris was ahead of me both times since I didn't know my way through the park. We finally had to have it towed. The dealer refused to give us a refund and return our trade-in. He said they needed to send it back to the distributor who we got on the phone and complained to and we said that the bike has never run properly. He told the mechanic to bring it back to him and they would do the work on it. He says he has gone as far as he can go with what they trained him to do. He rode it around a few times and it went just fine; even though we had just had it towed in. THEN, I said..." you need to ride it at about 20-30-k's and then let it idle for a minute. He did. It stalled. He tried to start it and it wouldn't until the 4th try. then he says "well, it seems to be fine now"....What a joke! And by the way, he refused to pay the tow on it as well. Good thing the towing company said they owed my husband a favor, so they waived the cost. (privately). I asked for a loaner bike; they refused. I told him they need to give me another bike or they need to give me my money back. They said they could not refund the money. Then went on to tell me that they didn't make any money on the sale. AND that they didn't get paid from their higher ups for the service and time that they put into working on it. Now, from where I'm sitting....the bike is under warranty. I asked my husband if he signed something that waived a refund. He had not. I said again, clearly something is wrong. The mechanic(s) agreed, but said there was nothing else they could do. Now, remember...we gave him the bike this past Tuesday and it wasn't ready umtil yesterday. He told us it was fine. He drove it for 10 k's. I told him the problem is when you are starting or slowing down. It just abruptly shuts off. Now, we had to leave it with them again. It's a holiday weekend here in Canada. So, it's sitting until next Wednesday to go to another city where the distributor is to be tested by THEIR mechanic. Who knows when it will come back. They have my money and my bike. I did take a video of us trying to start it, where we were, us trying to start it several more times before the tow truck guy started putting it up on the rack. I'm digusted. I'm soooo done. So sorry just read, was kinda skeptic of ur Dealer from first post most that offer those two and three year warranties i watch out for. I got a 15 day and 30 Day on electrical at a Family run business on mine, too many company's doing bad business and thats some BS! they made money on it that's there JOB! I wish u GOOD LUCK SUING THEM! |
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Post by ScooterChick on Jun 1, 2012 22:01:17 GMT -5
SETTLE IN FOLKS.....here it is: My husband is not willing to have his wife die needlessly because he wants to take bad workmanship "personally". If he had built the bike himself, I could see him feeling insulted. We never insulted him. But we did have some things to say about the craftsmenship of the product and record keeping practices of the company. He has been more concerned about defending himself personally than making things right with us when it is clear for the entire world to see that he cannot fix this bike. He told us that he did all he knows how to do according to the check list that he is given. So, saying I'm sorry does not fix the mechanical issues. Maybe he did say that, I certainly don't remember. I asked my husband and he said that he did apologize. But at this point, It doesn't matter. Because we later found out with the results of the day that he did not in fact mean it. We tried to start it yesterday to take it out and had trouble getting it to stay started. When it finally did start, it DIED while I was waiting for my husband to get the rest of his gear on (gloves and helmet). Very disappointing. So, we talked about what to do now and decided to try to start it again. This time it did start... (third try) and I said" we'd better hurry before it shuts off again"!. Then it sounded like a car does when it changes gears. I don't know what that is. and the RPM thing went from 1200 (which is where it was when it started sputtering) to 1800 in a flash. I was still only sitting there. Maybe that's normal?? I have no idea. So, I looked at my husband and he said "maybe it just warmed up". So, we headed out and went back to the place where we had it towed from a few days ago. It's highway getting there and once you get there you have to drive slow because it's a public park area. Anyway, we go and it seems to be ok except for this "weird" noise. I stopped and told my husband that it sounded like it was going to cut off like it did before. We just looked at each other. I gave it some gas and decided to keep going. Then we got to a nice lake area and pulled over, parked and took some pics. The whole stop was about 15-20 minutes. Went to start the bike......NOTHING! Tried again. NOTHING. Tried again and it started. this is what has been happening all along except this time it didn't cut off while I was actually driving. Thank God! We thought we had better head out and there was that "noise" again. I thought it might have been the fan as I saw the light come on a couple of times when we were traveling around 20k's per hour. But I don't think it was because after the fan went off, the noise was still there. It sounded and "felt" like it was running rough. as if you are driving over loose gravel, but you are actually on a smooth surface.  And the motor sounded like it was racing even though we weren't going that fast. We explained all of this to the dealer today. Ok, so we head out and hubby wants to take it in the other direction down the highway. I ain't too keen on this idea, but go along anyway. We take it to another beach area called Britania. I still hear the weird noise and gravel feeling off and on, but the fan light thing didn't come on this time as far as I could tell. We stop to get coffee. Walked around for a bit. About 45 minutes later go to leave and NOTHING. Bike won't start.....tried it again NOTHING. Tried it a few more times and it finally started and we took it back home. sheesh. It's just not reliable enough for me to take it to another province or touring around the US or something like that; which is why we bought it in the first place. Not trustworthy. So, we will be taking it back today. I"m just not interested in continuing, endless maintenance on this thing. It's not even time for the first service yet and the bike has been to the shop several times already. what a waste of time this has been for us. _________________ My thoughts: I am capable of forming my "own" opinion of a person on a personal or professional manner. Everybody in the world might think a company is the "cat's pajama's". But my opinion is based on my OWN experience with any company; not someone else's. I had no dealing with the company before now and I don't know anyone who did. So this is my ONLY impression and I NEVER said those word to this man. I said he either sucked as a mechanic or he sold me a lemon. That is what I said. He assured me it was not him. and I apologized to him for saying that. That was that. I have NEVER used profanity to this man. But he keeps insisting that I insulted him because I don't trust him. I don't have to. It's not an insult. It's my choice after how we have been treated. He gave his word.....He now has refused FOR THE SECOND TIME. His reason? He stating that he did not know how to make a refund on to our credit card. We told him it only took a call to the people who manage the system and they could tell him how. He didn't want to do that and went on to tell us that it was his choice how he chose to refund us. He offers us a check to be picked up at the end of the day. My husband just wanted the issue closed and asked him to make the call. He refused. Then he said "you think the check is going to bounce!" We didn't say that. Just wanted to walk out of the door with the situation behind us without having to come back for anything. But since he mentioned that, I guess it was is worth considering. Then he asked for two day. We reminded him that it had been two days since he promised. We just wanted to be done with it. I also want to say that his "change of mind" didn't come about until AFTER he kept us waiting at his front counter for 10-15 minutes while he was on the phone to someone. That fact is the bike keeps stalling just like the dealer. We have file footage of how the bike stalls out and we showed it to him. He still says after watching the video for himself today that "it starts right up". They rolled it into his garage (some friends of his, I guess) the guy had a time getting it to start. Two other people were standing there witnessing the whole thing. One guy looks at me and says " it won't start up". I said this is the problem that we have been having. Once it gets going it might be ok and it might not. The guy who the dealer told us later was not a mechanic and should not have even been sitting on the bike came in and said "it started right up". I did see the guy driving it around, but it DID NOT start right up. My husband, the dealer and myself heard them trying to get it started and it would for a while. If finally did. But it certainly DID NOT START RIGHT UP. I told my husband this guy was NOT going to keep his word. My husband being the honest guy that he is trust that everyone will be the same. They are not. He is surprised. I'M NOT. And he says we could report him if we wanted to and pretty much told he was not talking to us any more. He wants "more time" to test drive it himself. We had no reason to think that he had not ALREADY done this each time he "worked" on it. So, there you have it folks. If you don't "believe in" the dealer, he will not give you a refund on a substandard product. I even offered for him to just keep the money, give me my trade in back and we would just take the loss. He didn't want to do that either. So, draw your own conclusions.. Like I said, we have our conversations with him and the bike not working properly on video with time and date. He STILL insist that the bike has always run properly even after seeing the video for himself, the bike being in the shop 5 times in almost 6 weeks And that he "reserves the right to fix it". I forgot to say that my husband told him that if we could just simply be done with the whole thing, that I would send a post saying that he did in fact keep his word as promised. He stalled again and said he didn't believe I would. I offered to do it RIGHT THEN if he let me. It appeared to me that he had a computer with online access right there on the counter. Well, He didn't......SO I DIDN'T EITHER. This is where we are. Very, Very sad situation. __________________ |
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Post by doomsday on Jun 1, 2012 22:26:06 GMT -5
I am soo sorry to hear that they can't fix your brand new (that shouldn't need fixing) scooter. Personally, I say its time to call a lawyer and get them into court. You have given them AMPLE time to fix that thing. I don't understand why they just didnt give you another new one and ship that thing off to the company and get a refund themselves. I really hope something good can come out of this for ya Scooterchick. That is just not the way to do business.
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Post by ScooterChick on Jun 2, 2012 1:09:23 GMT -5
The dealer told us that he didn't think that the distributor was willing to give him a refund. We told him he had to take that issue up with them. What a mess. I will never deal with SAGA Canada again and certainly will never deal with J and R motorsports in Squamish, BC.
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Post by ce on Jun 2, 2012 16:20:19 GMT -5
At the top of this page is a thread about adjusting the valves for the Linhai 257 engine, and that is what you have.
Read it all the way through until you can follow the procedure, and then fix your scooter.
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Post by ScooterChick on Jun 4, 2012 18:12:50 GMT -5
We can't fix it ourselves as that would be their "out" in regard to the warranty.
I do however, have a 250cc Bet and Win from Kymco that I have been riding. If we do not hear from the Saga dealer in a week or so, we will give them a call. We have placed the Saga for sale and intend to give full disclosure as to the problems we have had with it. Some "wrench guy" may want to do the work on it and end up with a perfectly running machine. The dealer/mechanics certainly can't seem to get it done...
They suppose to have already adjusted the valves, replaced the electric start, some kind of a soleniod thingee, replaced carburator, and adjusted the valves...more than once. They still can't get it figured out. Pitiful.
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Post by ScooterChick on Jun 29, 2012 16:45:53 GMT -5
I JUST SOLD THIS BIKE AT FULL ASKING PRICE.......THANK GOD, THE NIGHTMARE HAS ENDED!
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Post by doomsday on Jul 2, 2012 8:54:53 GMT -5
I am so happy to hear you guys are finished with that nightmare. Although, I still say something needs to be done about the dealer and distributor. At the very least, file complaints on them as they certainly did not do what they should have done and that was replace the scooter. This is exactly the reason so many shops develop bad reputations. I think you guys went way above and beyond what is expected of customers. This was an outright dangerous situation with the scooter just shutting off in the middle of traffic and I don't think they took that seriously enough.
I know how scary it is to have a car cut off on you when your in 90mph traffic and have a big rig come running up on you. If I hadn't veered my car off onto the shoulder at 75mph, My wife and I would have been flattened. This was the slow lane and the speed limit was 75mph and nobody was going that slow. It is without a doubt the most scared I have ever been on any road.
Those folks you were dealing with are absolute jerks! I don't always agree that the customer is always right, but in your case, You were so in the right and those folks should be coming on here and offering you public apologies and freaking kissing both of your ass's for putting you through all that.
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Post by ScooterChick on Jul 4, 2012 18:41:08 GMT -5
We are happy to be done with that situation as well. I have a friend of mine whose husband just purchased her a Saga Quest from a private owner. I sure he hadn't done that. My trade-in (I'm sure) is still sitting at the shop of that dealer and it was a VERY reliable bike that she had driven many times before and got most of her riding time on. He purchased the other one because it was "so cute". Which I thought was sooo dumb considering all of the problems with that company that they were fully aware of. Well, low and behold....she is out in traffic and loses a bolt off the bike and it had to be pushed all the way to the dealer.... They didn't have the bolt at the shop, so they had to order it which was going to take a week! How can you not have the bolt at the shop (which they said was a simple fix) for a bike they sell as their main bike?? I don't know if she even has the bike back yet since I was away on a 12 day trip on my Bet and Win 250cc replacement bike. I just hope she doesn't have to keep taking it back to them for repairs. Maybe the dealer knows more about the 50cc's then the 250's, but I personally just wouldn't do business with them knowing what I do about how they conduct business. And would NEVER recommend them to anyone. I will be more than happy to tell my story to anyone who wants to know. In regard to my VERY FIRST long distance trip; which happen to be to Oregon and back to British Columbia, you can read the ride report and look at the pics at: www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=799933&highlight=Squampton. Happy trails! |
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And the motor sounded like it was racing even though we weren't going that fast.