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Post by AZscooter on Feb 2, 2007 20:03:59 GMT -5
In my youth I rode in T-shirt and Jeans. Now I Know I need protective gear. As there is a plethora of choices out there. I would like to hear what people are wearing. Pros, cons. good and bad. There are a lot of new riders and older riders that are just getting back to two wheels. Helmets are obvious but what about other gear. Thanks
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Post by Dennis D on Feb 2, 2007 20:45:55 GMT -5
I use my scoot for errands a lot. Even when I'm running errands, which I might do 3 or 4 times a day in warm weather, I wear helmet, with goggles or faceshield, gloves, boots, jeans, and the attitude that my safety is my own responsibility and no one else's. If it's not all that warm I also wear a denim jacket. Anytime it's somewhat cool or cold I wear a leather jacket instead. Of all those things, the realization that I alone am responsible for me coming back in one piece, so I need to be alert to all possibilities, is more important than all the safety gear I could possibly afford. Safety gear is important, but sometimes I think helmets and safety gear is emphasized so much that some riders depend on the gear to keep them safe. Like one coroner said, a helmet won't save your life if you lose your head.
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Post by earlwb on Feb 2, 2007 22:31:05 GMT -5
A helmet, eye protection, a good jacket, pants or chaps, boots and gloves. If possible jacket and pants should have the armor inserts or pads in them. The armor does wonders at preventing things like broken bones. it isn't perfect as nothing really helps in a crash. Leather is always a good choice, very tough, but anything helps to cut down on the road rash. I can say that I am extremely allergic to pavement. I can get really good road rashes if I don't wear lots of protection. Blue jeans only last about a split second when you hit the pavement. FieldSheer cycling apparel works really well. The best boots are SIDI brand. Gloves should have some velcro strap or something that you can cinch down to make it hard to have a glove come off in an accident.
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Post by einism on Feb 2, 2007 23:21:27 GMT -5
Corazzo Scooter jackets are about the best jackets Ive seen Made by scooterists for scooterists since sitting on a scooter isnt the same as a motorcycle these are made to fit well have removable armor and look nice they also sell other scooter stuff like a cover that goes over your legs in the winter and handlebar muffs for winter riding. Corazzo is sold in scooter shops all over the country and is a little spendy but the quality is high. you can also do0 a google to find their site
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Post by Leader on Feb 2, 2007 23:25:38 GMT -5
I have a new Kilamanjaro Air jacket. It's a mesh jacket with a really warm, waterproof liner. I haven't had this in warm weather, but in cold New England, I can ride with a sweater and this jacket down to the 30's. It comes with wimpy pads, I might upgrade them.
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Post by AZscooter on Feb 3, 2007 14:45:48 GMT -5
DennisD I tend to agree the most important protective gear my be an alert and attentive mind. Though helmet,jacket,pants certainly don,t hurt. But I agree with the idea of being solely responsible for your own safety.
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Post by gusset on Feb 7, 2007 11:30:17 GMT -5
Joe Rocket Meteor 4 jacket, First Gear HT II overpants, some riding gloves whose brand I can't remember, and a full face helmet. Mostly purchased online from New Enough Leathers...they've got some good prices there.
I agree that the attitude should be that my safety is my own responsibility, first and foremost. That's why I wear full gear. No matter how aware and alert I am, I can't be in total control of everything around me. If I do go down some day (no matter if the mistake was mine or someone else's), I want to maximize my chances of walking away in one piece. There's no "S" on my chest, so that's part of my definition of responsibility in this realm.
In the interest of full disclosure, though, I wear regular laced shoes. I hope to find a good compromise between protection and easy on/off sometime this year.
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Post by Dennis D on Feb 7, 2007 12:46:15 GMT -5
You're right you can't control everything. An oncoming vehicle can blow a tire and be across the line into you as fast as you can blink. We lost an acquaintance who was driving a small car that way. However there are accidents like that, or the guy I knew who hit the base of a light post with his helmet(cracked it and his head wide open) at relatively low speed, where all the safety gear anyone could afford, won't save their life. Either accident would be fatal to a scooterist, period. The first accident really couldn't be prevented at all by the innocent person in the opposite lane, but maybe could have been by the person whose tire blew, depending on their skill level. But we can only do anything about our own skill level. The second accident was a single vehicle accident and shouldn't have happened.
The reason I believe that too much emphasis is put on safety gear is because, if our bodies or our heads impact a curb, another vehicle, tree, etc at speed, safety gear is unlikely to save us from a debilitating injury or death. I think many riders have bought into the idea that safety gear equates to accident protection. Falling and sliding constitute a large number of motorcycle and scooter accidents, and the gear will save a lot of skin and protect your head if you go for a slide and don't hit anything solid protruding from the landscape.
But a very large percentage of accidents that kill, are going to kill regardless of the safety gear. Helmet studies I've read verify that. I believe there are a lot of riders who trust their life to the gear... but for the most part, what you can trust the gear to do is save your skin. Too many believe that putting on the gear equates to an "S" on the chest, because they see riders on tracks take serious spills every day on TV and walk away... but that's a controlled environment, no curbs, fire hydrants, cars, trucks, trees, etc to impact with when they miscalculate. On a track, what they mostly have to worry about is a nasty fall that twists and breaks bones, or getting run over. If you go down some day, depending on the environment(concrete, curbs, poles, other vehicles, etc) your chances of walking away in one piece COULD BE slim to none. If you go down in an ideal environment your safety gear can save you a lot of grief and a debilitating brain injury.
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Post by coyotesweat on Feb 7, 2007 17:05:12 GMT -5
Always: Fullmer full-face helmet, Joe Rocket Stella ladies' textile armor jacket (cheapest armored jacket on sale I could find that fit me), dirt bike gloves (fit me and have leather palms and joint protectors...when I have money I'll buy proper street gloves, but don't have the funds right not), and boots over the ankle. Would love to have the armored pants, but I'll be needing to ride to work, and it's awkward to change pants at work.
Katie
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Post by pezjunkie on Feb 16, 2007 13:01:15 GMT -5
I have a full face helmet for the winter and a half helmet for the summer. I couldnt stand the full face in the middle of summer heat, it got so hot once i had to pull over cause i thought i was going to pass out. Textile armored street bike jacket, leather gloves always, eye protection and good shoes. most people dont think about shoes but a good traction is definately a benefit. the things I stress the most is pay attention to your surroundings, know whats going on. Be confident in your riding and watch out for all the stupids out there.
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Post by Leader on Feb 18, 2007 22:56:30 GMT -5
In response to Dennis D.
You are wrong. See the Hurt Report.
On a personal note, I have fallen twice in the rain. Once I hit my helmeted head on the pavement very hard. I walked and rode away from both incidents with bruises or scratches. With out my safety gear, I would have suffered serious injury in at least one of those accidents.
Sure, some accidents will cause damage through the safety gear. With the gear, many will avoid injury, and some will be able to survive accidents that would kill an unprotected rider. It is not theraputic to argue against protective gear. It's a bit irresponsible for those of us with experience to argue against protective gear (children might be listening).
We need to emphasize protective gear, and we need to demand the best quality from manufacturers.
Here is a quote from the Motorcycle Safety Foundation which is part of the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration:
All motorcyclists should choose to wear protective apparel because they understand that such apparel can reduce injuries in a crash. All motorcyclists should want to wear FMVSS 218 [DOT approved] compliant helmets while riding to reduce head trauma resulting from a crash. Motorcyclists should understand the critical nature of apparel and how it provides comfort, in addition to protection, while riding. Their choices in apparel should be based on promotion from all motorcycle safety organizations, groups, clubs, other stakeholders, and the motorcycle industry. In states where there are helmet laws, law enforcement personnel should know how to identify FMVSS 218 compliant helmets.
So there you have it. Wear your protective gear. Wear good gear. Live to complain about having to wear protective gear.
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Post by Dennis D on Mar 2, 2007 0:31:29 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I always wear a helmet because hey, hat's my brain in there. And I've read the Hurt report many times... starting with the year it came out, many long years ago, as well as more recent reports from Europe and Taiwan on helmet use. If I'm in a serious accident that doesn't kill me, I'm much more likely to recover with an reasonably intact functioning brain if I'm wearing a helmet. I absolutely believe in wearing a helmet.
Do I believe that by wearing a helmet and more safety gear than I can possibly afford it would offer me adequate protection to go out and play in traffic on the interstates, where people's personalities begin to change as soon as they hit the on ramp? Absolutely not. If anyone wears all the safety safety gear, jumps on their crotch rocket and thinks that they can blast through their favorite scenic road impervious to harm because of it, that's pure foolishness.
State Rd 135 in Brown county IN going south from US 46 through the Hoosier National Forest claims the life of nearly one motorcyclist a week, and a nurse in an area hospital told me that many of them are wearing full safety gear(or nearly so). Safety gear won't save anyones life if they put it on and then expect it to protect them when they foolishly ride into harm's way.
Helmets should always be worn, period. Boots will keep you from breaking an ankle from casual accidental contact with the road. The rest of the gear can save a lot of skin, which can save a person from having a miserable year, with skin grafts, etc. But people who watch racers(who are mostly fairly young) roll across the pavement and ground in their safety gear and end up in the hay bales get up and walk away, often seem to think it will do the same for them on the street. Hello!! It's a closed course! Sliding in the rain and sliding down the pavement with your head surely would have injured you quite severely without your helmet, but if you'd been overcooking it on dry pavement and high sided instead of sliding, you could have come down on the edge of a curb. There ain't a helmet made that can withstand the force of someones 9 lb head in a 2 3/4 lb helmet with the weight of a 180 or 200 lb persons torso coming down on top of it against the corner of a curb or a concrete base of a light pole. And you can put on all the body armor you want, but if you crush your body against the bumper of an SUV, an immovable object like a large tree, or wrap it around a road sign, your body armor isn't going to save you from bleeding to death from ruptured internal organs that may also have bones poking through them. Safety gear will only protect you from the kind of injuries you might get racing on a closed course. If you trust the gear to be your safety net and never have an accident worse than that, you're lucky indeed. Safety gear isn't a panacea... and there are far too many people who believe it is. If constant preaching about safety gear makes people believe that the safety gear is likely to help them walk away from real life accidents out on the road... that may just put them in more danger than any amount of safety gear can save them from.
Nothing will help you if you have a really bad sort of accident on the road, but if people learn personal responsibilty and riding skills and defensive riding, it might keep it from happening to them. Or not! there are always things that could happen that neither any amount of training or safety gear can save us from. But hey, the alternative is, never leave home, and agoraphobia isn't much of a life.
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Post by cruseman on Mar 2, 2007 2:13:02 GMT -5
I totally agree with you Dennis, your safety gear can only do so much. If a person acts like superman with his safety clothing on, time will tell when he will fall victim to some harsh reality. To me all should use common sense, be a defensive rider and use protective clothing including helmets. Remember cars always win
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Post by fangerman on Mar 13, 2007 14:16:07 GMT -5
The point Dennis is arguing is that no amount of safety gear can make up for foolishness. I have been through some stringent safe-driving courses for cars and they make so much more sense to me now that I am on my scooter regularly. Always look far enough up the road to know where you will be in 15 seconds. Know what potential hazards are at every cross street or intersection. Never trust anyone on the road to see you and look out for your safety. (I could have avoided my accident if I had remembered that one.) Keep your eyes moving at all times. You should always have an exit plan should an emergency arise...can you swerve off the road? Can you swerve into another lane? Can you do a panic stop without getting rear-ended? Use your horn and communicate in traffic. Make sure that other drivers see you. If you are unsure, don't proceed until you are certain. You have to be 100% responsible for your own life and just knowing and expecting the unexpected at all times will keep your expensive safety gear looking nice along with your body inside it. Sadly, most of us will experience some sort of accident at some point while riding. Safety gear can minimize the damage and should never be omitted. It's all about trying to reduce the odds of your getting hurt in an accident and the gear is only one part of it.
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Post by Leader on Mar 27, 2007 7:53:22 GMT -5
Ok, so we all agree then.
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Post by Dennis D on Mar 27, 2007 18:51:06 GMT -5
"It's all about trying to reduce the odds of your getting hurt in an accident and the gear is only one part of it." Quote - fangerman Yup, the #1, most important part of it is to learn, remember, observe, and then apply your knowledge, to reduce the odds of gettning in an accident in the 1st place. But we're all human, so if we miss something, mess up, or something comes straight at us with no warning, that's where the safety gear comes in. Then we can only hope it doesn't end up like this accident: "So I was in Las Vegas yesterday and came upon the scene of an accident. I was expecting it to be a car vs. car but there in the middle of the intersection was a scooter. I couldn't even tell what kind it was. It was hit so bad it looked like it had exploded! Pieces were everywhere including a helmet that was completely broken in half. There were mulitple law enforcement units who were there for longer than 3 hours. " From the 1st post in this thread: www.urbanscootin.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5440&start=0
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Post by surfborg on Mar 27, 2007 21:34:08 GMT -5
I just upgraded my riding gear to include a real riding jacket. It's got vents and pockets and liner and armour. I figure the pavement is gonna hurt just as bad with my scooter as it would with a Harley. I agree. Pay attention AND be prepared!
Surf
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Post by Charlie on Mar 27, 2007 22:49:36 GMT -5
My wife, son and I were coming back from a trip to Hot Springs coming up Arkansas 7. There were three sport bikes behind us. They came on us fast, real fast!. I knew they wanted to pass because they were about 2' off my bumper. So I signaled and start to into a turnout when one of them decided to pass me on the right. I saw him in time and straightened out.
He was riding a Ninja. When he saw me pulling over he nailed the throttle to get past me instead of backing off. When he cleared me he corrected left and his rate of speed was WOW!
The trouble with his course correction is that it caused him to fishtail severely..while he tried to ride it out he crossed into the other lane with a truck coming the other way.
This time his reaction was to nail the throttle and turn hard left. When he did, his bike straightened out and he went off the road on the oncoming side and launched himself over a 150' cliff. He was wearing full body armor including a chest protector, kevlar shin and leg protectors, a Bell full face helmet and all leather right down to the gloves.
Long story short his chute didn't deploy.
Now don't get me wrong but when you take the trouble to purchase $650 worth of safety gear you would think that you would know the danger of driving like a complete A hole wouldn't you?
Well, in this case the guy died. There was nothing left of his bike except pieces about the size of a loaf of bread. The engine wound up in Jack Pine about 75' off the ground.
It is about common sense! Nothing more, nothing less. You act a fool you pay dearly. When you ride you choose your own destiny. Take it serious and you can still see the scenary. Take it lightly, someone will be looking over a 150' cliff going....damn that's a mess! Wonder if he had a wife and kids?
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Post by earlwb on Mar 29, 2007 6:31:53 GMT -5
Out here, it is common to see the guys riding sport bikes, with only their swim trunks on, nothing else. There they go, popping wheelies, doing burnouts, rear wheel brake stands and stuff. One moron, was riding while sitting on top of the handlebars no less. Yup he lost it. Some serious skin and head injuries as they carried him off to the hospital.
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Post by johnnyscoots on Mar 29, 2007 10:45:54 GMT -5
It's sad to see how so many guys in their early 20's need a severe spill to learn how abrasive asphalt can be at highway speeds. Just the spills I've seen on YouTube are enough to warrant many layers of clothes, boots, and a full face helmet.
Looking to get one of those armored mesh jackets for warm weather.
John
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Post by AZscooter on Apr 4, 2007 8:11:30 GMT -5
Johnnyscoots Look at motodirectusa.com for mesh jacket. Has good padding and a easy zip out liner. good in cold weather. Great in hot weather with the liner out. Great price. Both my wife and I have them.
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Post by earlwb on Apr 4, 2007 9:25:40 GMT -5
I have had good vibes buying stuff from www.motoliberty.com/. I got their Fieldsheer jacket and pants, with zip out liners. They work in a very wide range of temperatures. Olympia also has a great mesh jacket as well.
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