Tank 250 - Overheating

[livewire]

I finally got my Tank on the road, and thankfully I decided to approach any distance cautiously. I was out today and rode about 12 or 15 Km..with a few steep hills ( this is Connecticut) and my temp gage pegged out on the red line. I got home but i knew the engine was hot and i dribbled a few tablespoon fuls of antifreeze.
I know there's a radiator and fan that i need to check out as well as a thermostat.
Has anyone else had this issue on a new Tank? if so, what did you find?

Thanks!

[luciano136]

That's no good. Are you sure the engine was overheating? Never know it's a temp sensor failure...

Maybe the below mentioned service manual will be a good starting point...

For whatever it's worth, I rode mine home last night in 90+ degrees for 20mi. The temp sensor only went up to the middle; in normal temps it stays just a little below the middle. So, the couple of hills shouldn't make it overheat. (I think I have the same engine)...

Let me know what you find!

[scooterollie]

livewire;
The cooling system is the most problematic thing on these 250s. It is not just a problem w/Tank 250s. First, many of the temp. gauges are grossly inaccurate. They will peg but most of the time the system is not overheating. But, you do have to be cautious at first to be certain it is not a more serious problem. When you said ..."and i dribbled a few tablespoon fuls of antifreeze.", what do you mean and do you know from where? What is the coolant level in the overflow tank (cold)? If you start the scoot and let it idle for an extended time, what does the gauge do? Can you hear the cooling fan cycle on/off? If the fan is cycling on and off as it runs at idle, the system is probably OK, no matter what the gauge registers. A new scoot will seem to be hotter than it really is what with all that hot coolant circulating around under the body panels in the new rubber hoses and metal parts. If you have ridden an air cooled bike before, it does take some getting use to the water cooled smell and feel.

Make certain all coolant hoses are properly secured on the bibs and tightly clamped. There is even a small one - vacuum hose diameter - coming off the carb.

[livewire]

I will double check the level of coolant in the overflow...not sure where the small puddle on the ground came from.. Your right that i did see some smoke or fumes coming from the inside after i stopped but i understand that there's only 35 KM on it and it's burning off all kinds of residue. I DID NOT hear a fan.....when i let it idle for 10 min or so..i hear nothing added....i'll have to listen..
i'll keep u posted
Thx

[90GTVert]

Don't bother checking the fluid.... REPLACE IT. Then, with the filler cap off, bring the scooter up to temp and keep refilling until it stops dropping. Be sure you have checked all hoses for tight clamps and no kinks. Once it's at temp and full, cap it. You can't hear the fan when the engine is running, so I wired a LED into my dash so I could see when the fan is on. You can remove the hump cover and see the fan, which I would do when changing fluid anyway. 95% of the time, the over heating is actually a poorly calibrated gauge and not really over heating. Stan

livewire said:

I will double check the level of coolant in the overflow...not sure where the small puddle on the ground came from.. Your right that i did see some smoke or fumes coming from the inside after i stopped but i understand that there's only 35 KM on it and it's burning off all kinds of residue. I DID NOT hear a fan.....when i let it idle for 10 min or so..i hear nothing added....i'll have to listen..
i'll keep u posted
Thx

[swampsniper]

It is a pressurized system, designed for a coolant temperature above the boiling point of 212f.
If design temperature is exceeded the vent will open and dump steam and coolant. If this isn't happening the guage is probably wrong.

[pressman1966]

ok, i hope that this helps on a repair of a out of caliber sending unit/gauge. I hope it work, this link is the first i ever posted on it or here. vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=2028162782

[monty57]

livewire,

I don't know if the Tank is wired like the Roadrunner, but I was unable to hear the fan cycle with scoot running. When I tuned off the ignition I never heard the fan. I found I had to stop the engine with "kill switch" and leave the key "on" to have the fan cycle. That was the only time I could hear it. Try listening to it right after you stop the engine with key "on". If the fan only runs for a short time you are probably not overheating but have a faulty gauge. If the fan runs for a long time or you are spitting out coolant, I would first start by draining the coolant, flushing the system and refilling.

I am not sure how experienced you are, or how much the Tank and Roadrunner are assembled alike but I do know they have the exact same engine. I believe your radiator is mounted further back in the frame than mine. Anyway, I have posted a step by step with pictures on the process of changing the coolant on this type engine (Roadrunner 250 TLX - Changing Coolant) on this forum. Maybe it will help. Good Luck!

[livewire]

Well i opened the engine compartment and watched the fan as the scooter ran and warmed up..the fan never came on......i chased the wiring and found that one of the contacts in the connector had been pushed half way out the back end, probably as it was snapped together. I re-inserted the contact and the fan came on...so tonight i'll run the scooter with the fan operational and see how the temp does.

[livewire]

BY the way..i really like that video of the gage replacement..very cool...wish there was more of that available

[scooterollie]

livewire;
Great! Glad you were able to diagnose and repair the problem. On these Chinese scoots the cause is often simple but you must catch it before does damage.

[linda]

I took my new roketa out for a short ride, before you know it I had radiator fluid spewing out of the cap with my temp gauge in the red. It seemes like a long journey home( about a mi.) fearing I did do some damage. The sad part is I only have a little over 5 mi on my new scoot. I never heard the fan come on. I changed the coolant but am afraid to ride until the fan is fixed. Please help. Could it be a fuse, or a connection in those small plastic boxes. Watch should I be looking for. Why does my vin plate say mfg. 2006 and my title say it's a 2007?.

[scooterollie]

Linda;
Sorry you have had problems with your new scoot. That really steals the fun!

Your scooter is just like a new model car made in one year but titled as the next year. No problem there.

Sounds like you are really in over your head on this one. Have you tried talking with the place where you purchased your scoot? That should be the first step. If they are no help, you need someone in your vicinity who is a good small engine mechanic. being water cooled, the 250 scoots present more potential problems than the air cooled ones. Something obviously caused your cooling system to overheat and blow. The cause will have to be found and corrected. If you ran the scoot for a good distance without coolant, you could have caused damage to the engine.

If you do not get any satisfaction from your dealer and are not able to get it running properly, you should contest the issue with your credit card company - if you paid with a credit card.

[90GTVert]

They are wired differently. The Tank doesn't run the fan when the key is turned off, but the RR250 does (don't know on the TLX model). I installed a small LED in the dash hood on the Tank, which lights when the fan is on. I have not yet done this with the RR250, but I will very soon. With the Tank, if the fan is working normally, you can't hear it when the engine is running, so I like having an indicator for it. These scooters are prone to air lock, so it's very important to warm the scooter with the radiator cap off and refil as needed until the level stops dropping, then cap it. Most of the cooling problems are caused by low coolant, air lock, fan is inoperable (bad connections), or just bad gauge calibration and not really overheating. Stan

monty57 said:

livewire,

I don't know if the Tank is wired like the Roadrunner, but I was unable to hear the fan cycle with scoot running. When I tuned off the ignition I never heard the fan. I found I had to stop the engine with "kill switch" and leave the key "on" to have the fan cycle. That was the only time I could hear it. Try listening to it right after you stop the engine with key "on". If the fan only runs for a short time you are probably not overheating but have a faulty gauge. If the fan runs for a long time or you are spitting out coolant, I would first start by draining the coolant, flushing the system and refilling.

I am not sure how experienced you are, or how much the Tank and Roadrunner are assembled alike but I do know they have the exact same engine. I believe your radiator is mounted further back in the frame than mine. Anyway, I have posted a step by step with pictures on the process of changing the coolant on this type engine (Roadrunner 250 TLX - Changing Coolant) on this forum. Maybe it will help. Good Luck!

[buckeyescoot]

Livewire -

One other thing I may add. Check the radiator neck fill. The hose nipple from the carb on mine (Roketa Bali 250 )cracked and anti-freeze was leaking there. I purchased a replacement at the local Honda part department to get the scooter back on the road.

I too, had a backed out wire on my connector to the radiator fan and had to re-seat it. I got some good information of Stan Jessup's web page on the 250s so I knew about the air lock situation and did the uncap and fill technique the first evening.

Joe

[linda]

I pulled that middle panel off again and started playing with some of those plastic boxes, making sure there together. Started the scoot, watched it idle for a few and the fan kicked on. Was I psyched!! Should I keep the oveerflow bucket half full to make sure the radiator is full or start the scoot then take the cover off to check. I don't want to get an air pocket but want to make sure I have the proper amount. Your right if we can get the quirks worked out, for a scoot under 2,000.00. I was never to mechanically inclined but I'm having to learn quick. Thanks to this forum I've already learned alot. I flushed the coolant, the oil, and the gear fuel.

[scooterollie]

Linda;
If you have not already filled your cooling system as per the instructions given at the link below, do so. After filling the system, adjust the level in the recovery/oveflow tank to, at least, the "Minimum" line, but I would not fill it any more than 1/2 way between the two lines.

After doing the above, run the scoot at idle, or on a drive, until it is fully warmed up. If the coolant is staying where it belongs (inside the system!), shut it down and look at the overflow tank. The level of coolant should have gone up somewhere + or - the top line. Allow the scoot to thoroughly cool and re-check the level in the tank. If all is OK, the level should have gone back done to where it was when you completed the above.

www.oregonvintage.com/Coolant.pdf

[linda]

I flushed my system again, this time I added the dextron instead of preston 50/50. I took it for a short ride and all seemed OK, except that after I turned the kill switch off I could still hear the fan running ( finally fixed the fan , loose connection. Should I let the fan run until it stops or shut the scoot off all together?

[mattcorby]

pressman1966 - that link for your video doesn't work for me, can you post a link that works, that would help out a lot because i think my guage is out of calibration pretty bad

linda - my guage is so out of whack that the needle is towards the top at regular operating temp, so when my bike overheated due to the radiator fill neck bursting into peices i didn't even know for about a mile or 2. i've put about 50km on the bike since then and it runs better than ever. if anything i think that just finished breaking in the motor.

[monty57]

Linda,

I think it is good idea to let the fan run until it stops on it's own. It is usually only about a minute on mine. I think the wait may be worth it in the long run. Just an opinion.

[linda]

I will take your advice and let the fan run. I'm sorry, I don't mean to laugh about your radiator neck exploding into pieces, it's just the way you put it. My radiator is already shaped like an elongated egg and I have less than 10mi. I don't know if I should check the coolant fluid everyday because the neck is already so warped. The original cap didn't fit and with the overheating problems. Would once a week be sufficient. At the rate I'm going I'll be needing to replace that neck shortly.

Thanks.
Linda

[scooterollie]

Linda;
My Roketa Bali 250 fan will often still be running when I turn off the ignition switch. Turning off the switch doesn't stop the fan. It will continue to run anywhere from a few seconds to almost a minute, depending on the heat built up in the system. This is normal. You don't have to leave the engine run until the fan stops. The cooling fans on many cars are set up the same way. Perhaps you have walked by a car with the engine off, no one around and the fan running.

[linda]

Hi,

I took my scoot for a long ride this morning and happily everything ran great!! The temp gauge is consistently staying in the middle. I'm also noticing whenever I ride the scoot it seems to perform better. This is my first motorized two wheeler and although my top speed has only been 35 with the potholes in this city my adrenaline is pumped and I'm loving every minute of it. Thanks again for everyone that helped me get my scooter running. I now feel a little foolish for ranting and raving about my scooter when it first arrived.

Linda

[scooterollie]

Linda;
Glad to hear all is well!

[runrun]

Hi Linda,

Theirs noting like having a nice running scoot enjoy!!

linda said:

Hi,

I took my scoot for a long ride this morning and happily everything ran great!! The temp gauge is consistently staying in the middle. I'm also noticing whenever I ride the scoot it seems to perform better. This is my first motorized two wheeler and although my top speed has only been 35 with the potholes in this city my adrenaline is pumped and I'm loving every minute of it. Thanks again for everyone that helped me get my scooter running. I now feel a little foolish for ranting and raving about my scooter when it first arrived.

Linda

[monty57]

Linda,

Good going. Evidently you are a better mechanic then you thought. Hopefully you will continue to enjoy your scoot. Sounds like you got the rough part over.

[rony]

Tank had a batch of bad 250 Tourings last year. They all had overheating problems. They supposedly fixed all of them (and did pay $70 toward labor on each instance) but it is possible that you got one of those bikes. Please look at the enclosed instructions and note that if your scooter has this problem, the sensor must be changed and you must recalibrate the thermostat. You should be able to call Tank and have them check by VIN if your bike has that problem.

I have 3 pdf documents in my possession. I don't know how to add attachments to this post but will send email them over to Stan who may be able to either post them on his site or get them to you somehow.

Thank you,
Rony

[rony]

sorry I did not see I could click on your profile and send you an email. Let me know if this works out for you. You can share those documents...

[livewire]

Thx Rony....My problem seems to have been corrected by fixing the electrical connector to the fan, but i'll sure check on the screw that may be a problem downstream.

[90GTVert]

I have the 3 PDF files, but I can't post them without Tanks permission, which will never happen. But, they basically cover replacing the coolant, which has been covered much better in other documents. In most cases I have encountered, the overheating is either due to an air lock in the system because it was not purged, or false gauge readings. I do think it is critical to verify your cooling fan operation also. That being said, I highly recommend replacing the factory coolant with a good grade of 50/50 coolant designed for aluminum engines. Any motorcycle shop will have it.

The second one is checking the rear brake hose for possible contact (and damage) with the muffler. The solution was to wire tie it so it can't contact the hot exhaust.

The third one is checking the possible screw damage to the breather vent hose. The screw that could cause the damage is in the rear access panel under the seat. Tanks solution is to leave the inboard screw out. I suggest simply grinding the tip so it is blunt and can't make contact. Stan

rony said:

Tank had a batch of bad 250 Tourings last year. They all had overheating problems. They supposedly fixed all of them (and did pay $70 toward labor on each instance) but it is possible that you got one of those bikes. Please look at the enclosed instructions and note that if your scooter has this problem, the sensor must be changed and you must recalibrate the thermostat. You should be able to call Tank and have them check by VIN if your bike has that problem.

I have 3 pdf documents in my possession. I don't know how to add attachments to this post but will send email them over to Stan who may be able to either post them on his site or get them to you somehow.

Thank you,
Rony