Interested in a Burgman 400? Live near Atlanta?

[danno711]

I like to surf Craigslist for deals...I came across this one near Atlanta and thought I'd share it.....Sorry no picture

Only 550 miles! 2004 Suzuki Burgman - $2800 (Rome/Cartersville)
Date: 2013-01-11, 12:12PM EST


2004 Suzuki Burgman 400cc. Dark Blue
Like New! Ridden less than a dozen times!
One owner ONLY HAS 550 MILES ON IT!!!
Has been tuned up & is ready to ride!
$2,800.00

atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/mcy/3508840320.html

[prodigit]

What's gonna be your main use for it?
If you do a lot of highway traveling, it will be able to do it, however you find that the engine runs quite hard to get to 70MPH speeds.
Also, if you look online you will find a lot of those burgman 400's returned, or for sale second hand, and very few bidders on them.
They're not bad bikes, perhaps for many not worth the money they have invested in them,; for others maybe it lacks power, and yet others don't like a CVT on big bikes.
The 2004 versions, don't have fuel injection yet, so their mpg's will be rather high.

I prefer manual gears myself, and fuel injection.

But aside from that, the burgmans are very capable bikes, very good looking too!

[millsc]

hes just sharing a deal ^^

[SylvreKat]

Has anyone told danno yet? Although Atlanta might be a bit far from Houston....

>'Kat

[prodigit]

The dealer nearby sells 2 of them, 2006 and 2009 models, $3600.
They've been there for at least 1/2 year.

Another dealer I know has 1 second hand model for sale. Both dealers have a lot of new Burgmans for sale (2011, 2012, and 2013 models).
In 1/2 years that I've seen them, I've seen 1 650 sold (the bigger version), but zero 400's.
Makes me wonder why...
I don't

[danno711]

Jan 15, 2013 18:32:04 GMT -5 SylvreKat said:

Has anyone told danno yet? Although Atlanta might be a bit far from Houston....

>'Kat

Let's all keep it a secret from Kat just who started this thread

Just having some fun Kat...

No offense intended.

[danno711]

Jan 15, 2013 19:19:16 GMT -5 prodigit said:

The dealer nearby sells 2 of them, 2006 and 2009 models, $3600.
They've been there for at least 1/2 year.

Another dealer I know has 1 second hand model for sale. Both dealers have a lot of new Burgmans for sale (2011, 2012, and 2013 models).
In 1/2 years that I've seen them, I've seen 1 650 sold (the bigger version), but zero 400's.
Makes me wonder why...
I don't

Likely to do more with the economy, than the value of the bike.
Lot's of people just don't have money to play with.

[rockynv]

Don't know why one would think that the 400 Burgman struggles at 70. Both the Burgman and Majesty 400 are capable of highway touring riding double. Could actually be too much bike for some people at over 400 lbs. Top speed reported by owners is 110 indicated 105 actual after the engine is broken in. Top speed advertised by Suzuki for the 2005 400 is around 98 mph.

Here is a road test review of the 2007 when they raised the cc from 385 to a full 400 upping HP a bit over the original 32 and bumping torque a bit to:
www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/suzu/suzuki_burgman%20400%2005.htm

[danno711]

Jan 15, 2013 22:24:47 GMT -5 rockynv said:

Don't know why one would think that the 400 Burgman struggles at 70.

Probably from someone who's never owned one and he pretends he doesn't want one.

[prodigit]

I didn't say the engine struggles, but works hard.
Meaning, it's not unusual to be riding around 6k+RPM @70mph.
For reference, a V-star 950 would probably be running below 4k RPM at that speed.

[danno711]

Jan 15, 2013 22:33:15 GMT -5 prodigit said:

For reference, a V-star 950 would probably be running below 4k RPM at that speed.

I prefer manual gears myself, and fuel injection.

Do you by chance own a motorcycle and not a scooter?

Just wondering...

[scootnwinn]

The Burgman redlines at 8.5k at 70mph it is running about 6k. The redline is by all accounts conservatively imposed by the cdi so how is it working hard? Most cruisers redline around 6k and stop increasing the production of hp about 1000 rpms before that so which one is working harder. You used to say what a bother it was to shift now suddenly your an advocate hmmm... Stick to what you know

[SylvreKat]

Jan 15, 2013 19:20:40 GMT -5 danno711 said:

Let's all keep it a secret from Kat just who started this thread

Just having some fun Kat...

No offense intended.

See, this is what happens when you let a blonde loose on the forums. Esp when you tell her you're looking for a good deal on a certain bike. She just jumps on it and doesn't bother to read the boring little print along the side. You know, the worthless details, like gender, # of posts, name....



("None taken." Chief, "Outlaw Josie Wales")

>'Kat

[inuyasha]

Jan 15, 2013 22:57:26 GMT -5 SylvreKat said:

Jan 15, 2013 19:20:40 GMT -5 danno711 said:

Let's all keep it a secret from Kat just who started this thread

Just having some fun Kat...

No offense intended.

See, this is what happens when you let a blonde loose on the forums. Esp when you tell her you're looking for a good deal on a certain bike. She just jumps on it and doesn't bother to read the boring little print along the side. You know, the worthless details, like gender, # of posts, name....



("None taken." Chief, "Outlaw Josie Wales")

>'Kat

Hi Kat
No worries
We still love ya here at the dog pound ;D

Take care and ride safely dear friend
Yours Hank

[danno711]

Jan 15, 2013 22:57:26 GMT -5 SylvreKat said:

Jan 15, 2013 19:20:40 GMT -5 danno711 said:

Let's all keep it a secret from Kat just who started this thread

Just having some fun Kat...

No offense intended.

See, this is what happens when you let a blonde loose on the forums. Esp when you tell her you're looking for a good deal on a certain bike. She just jumps on it and doesn't bother to read the boring little print along the side. You know, the worthless details, like gender, # of posts, name....



("None taken." Chief, "Outlaw Josie Wales")

>'Kat

If we were honest with each other, we'd have no problem admitting we all have our blonde moments.

Just glad it wasn't me ;D

[qwertydude]

Jan 15, 2013 22:33:15 GMT -5 prodigit said:

I didn't say the engine struggles, but works hard.
Meaning, it's not unusual to be riding around 6k+RPM @70mph.
For reference, a V-star 950 would probably be running below 4k RPM at that speed.

You think 6000 rpm is working hard? Try riding a ninja 250 at highway speeds. 10,000 rpm's and yet these engines last upwards of 50,000 miles even with regular freeway use. I suppose if you consider that short lived then yes it won't last. But 6000 rpm's shouldn't be a problem for engines that were designed for it and the Burgman being a touring scooter was certainly designed to run at freeway speeds for long stretches.

[rockynv]

Jan 15, 2013 23:55:47 GMT -5 qwertydude said:

Jan 15, 2013 22:33:15 GMT -5 prodigit said:

I didn't say the engine struggles, but works hard.
Meaning, it's not unusual to be riding around 6k+RPM @70mph.
For reference, a V-star 950 would probably be running below 4k RPM at that speed.

You think 6000 rpm is working hard? Try riding a ninja 250 at highway speeds. 10,000 rpm's and yet these engines last upwards of 50,000 miles even with regular freeway use. I suppose if you consider that short lived then yes it won't last. But 6000 rpm's shouldn't be a problem for engines that were designed for it and the Burgman being a touring scooter was certainly designed to run at freeway speeds for long stretches.

Try the Aprilia re-engineered version of that 250 Suzuki engine. Some get 150+ mph out of it on the track.

The Burgman 400 was designed for the interstate from the ground up with an engine matched for use with a CVT drive.

The V-Star 950 runs at low rpm because it is a fairly long stroke V-Twin that is not designed to rev high and has a gear box matched to that particular motor.

I ride with a number of Boulevard 850 and V-Star 1,800 riders and they are heavy lumbering machines that don't seem to do much very well except for plod along on fairly straight roads. The rides are usually marked by one or two of them sliding off the road and at times going over on the crash bars or side cases.

I find the 250cc to 400cc scooters have a much higher fun factor and are much more practicle.

[danno711]

You rock!

[prodigit]

Jan 15, 2013 22:53:00 GMT -5 scootnwinn said:

The Burgman redlines at 8.5k at 70mph it is running about 6k. The redline is by all accounts conservatively imposed by the cdi so how is it working hard? Most cruisers redline around 6k and stop increasing the production of hp about 1000 rpms before that so which one is working harder. You used to say what a bother it was to shift now suddenly your an advocate hmmm... Stick to what you know

Umm.. Dunno whom you're talking about, but:
1- I always prefered and loved manual gearing over CVT
2- It is a known fact that running an engine at lower RPMs extends life; plus gives you some extra headroom.
On just about any geared machine, the optimum gearing is to ride at highway speeds between 2000 and 3500RPM.
Though scooters can do highway speeds, they're often running near to the top of their revs.
If you have the money to go for a 400, then might as well buy a real motorcycle, cause IMHO, there's nothing fun about a CVT that does not do what you want to do.

Scootards might not understand, but when you're on the highway, 400cc is really nothing.
Sure it will be able to go 75MPH, a ninja does almost 100MPH, but acceleration is real slow at those speeds.
going with a burgman @75mph, is like going with a 50cc @35-40MPH. Takes forever to overtake someone at those speeds; highly revved, which results in low MPG's, and higher engine wear...
For a big bike; in fact, for just any bike except the cheapest ones, manual gears is a lot better.
Perhaps a CVT can be tuned for fast acceleration, but it does affect MPG; or low RPMs, but that also results in low acceleration.

In my opinion nothing beats a manual transmission.

[qwertydude]

2000-3500 RPM will lug a ninja 250 engine and ruin the engine faster than riding high RPM's constantly because the parts weren't designed to operate at such low RPM's. Engines are designed to operate most efficiently within a certain rpm band. This isn't a fixed rpm across all engine types.

Smaller engines need to rev higher to make power and so were designed to operate reliably at those RPM's. Forcing engines to operate below their optimum RPM range is inefficient and can lead to damage due to lugging.

And I don't think you understand just how much power that Burgman 400 really has. It's top speed is 100 mph. That leaves quite a bit of wiggle room for extra passing speed.

Would you be saying the same thing about the Harley Davidson Sportster 883? That it's incapable of freeway riding? Even though that bike is over twice the displacement of the Burgman 400 it's top speed is about the same, 100 mph.

It's not about displacement it's about power and both bikes have similar power and I'd put dollars to donuts if you ride a Burgman cross country several times at freeway speeds it will give you less trouble than riding a Sportser 883 cross country. Not to mention the liquid cooling certainly adds to better durability of the engine so that even though the Burgman is a smaller higher stressed engine, it's likely to outlast the Harley engine even though the Harley engine is lower revving.

You see there's a difference between RPM and piston velocity/geometry. On lower revving engines sure RPM is lower but actual piston velocity is about the same due to the length of the stroke. What does this mean? Well it means even though you're revving less, that piston is travelling longer distances up and down. This adds to piston wear and much more added vibration. Not only that but the air cooled Harley engine means it needs more clearance from piston to cylinder to keep piston expansion in check due to high cylinder head temperatures so the piston isn't scuffing against the cylinder. This means pistons rock back and forth more and are more likely to oval. All these temperature differences and loose tolerances is why Harley's tend to lose compression early and they tend to crack gaskets due to uneven expansion and contraction due to large temperature differences in different parts which is why they're so prone to leakage.

How is the Burgman different? Well it has a short stroke so piston rocking and piston velocity is lower so wearing the piston out is far less an issue. Then you have a liquid cooled engine which will extend engine life by keeping the whole engine a more uniform temperature and lets the engine builder build much tighter piston to cylinder clearances because the piston isn't expanding as much into the cylinder this means even less piston rocking for even less piston wear.

[prodigit]

The peak torque of an engine does not mean they are designed to operate there,
They have just been optimized to perform best there,
But general knowledge says an engine runs best, just above 1500 rpm; ANY engine.
That means Diesels as well as gasoline, 50cc and 5000 cc. trucks and cars and scooters alike.

Usually the problem is that when engaging in a heavier gear, and still wanting to ride at the same speed, that the engine gets ballasted more.
However, it more than gets compensated for a lesser ballast at a much higher speed (comparing an engine running at 2k rpm with one at 6k rpm, the one at 6k goes 3x faster, thus rubs 3 times more at a lower pressure ) .

[inuyasha]

Hi
Lots of Burgs for sale on CL in or near CT
newhaven.craigslist.org/search/mca?query=burgman&srchType=A&zoomToPosting=&minAsk=&maxAsk=
Takercare and ride safely
Yours Hank

[scootnwinn]

Jan 16, 2013 18:10:47 GMT -5 prodigit said:

The peak torque of an engine does not mean they are designed to operate there,
They have just been optimized to perform best there,
But general knowledge says an engine runs best, just above 1500 rpm; ANY engine.
That means Diesels as well as gasoline, 50cc and 5000 cc. trucks and cars and scooters alike.

Usually the problem is that when engaging in a heavier gear, and still wanting to ride at the same speed, that the engine gets ballasted more.
However, it more than gets compensated for a lesser ballast at a much higher speed (comparing an engine running at 2k rpm with one at 6k rpm, the one at 6k goes 3x faster, thus rubs 3 times more at a lower pressure ) .

Actually general knowledge here is that you generally have no idea what your talking about. A wise man once said, "It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth (in this case that would be your keyboard) and remove all doubt" Its good advice and you should consider it. Enjoy your Honda in another forum.

[qwertydude]

Jan 16, 2013 18:10:47 GMT -5 prodigit said:

The peak torque of an engine does not mean they are designed to operate there,
They have just been optimized to perform best there,
But general knowledge says an engine runs best, just above 1500 rpm; ANY engine.
That means Diesels as well as gasoline, 50cc and 5000 cc. trucks and cars and scooters alike.

Usually the problem is that when engaging in a heavier gear, and still wanting to ride at the same speed, that the engine gets ballasted more.
However, it more than gets compensated for a lesser ballast at a much higher speed (comparing an engine running at 2k rpm with one at 6k rpm, the one at 6k goes 3x faster, thus rubs 3 times more at a lower pressure ) .

I'd really like to know where you got that 1500 RPM figure because I can tell you if I tried to run my Sym Wolf at that low an RPM the engine would either knock so bad it would destroy itself, the bearings would lose all their oil film strength and would fail because oil lubricated bearings have a minimum operating speed based on oil film thickness and bearing design, my engine would produce next to no power, or just plain the engine stalls.

If 1500 RPM was taught as general engineering knowledge I certainly missed that day in industrial machinery and engine theory. There's definitely a difference. Take for example some of the biggest engines, the Wärtsilä RT-flex96C, it has a maximum RPM of 102 RPM yeah that's all, it powers the biggest ships in the world. Yet you couldn't push it to 1500 RPM's, it would literally disintegrate.

Engines are designed to perform within a certain performance envelope, you can't operate them outside that without risking serious damage or serious performance loss.

[rockynv]

The guys I ride with are constantly playing the displacement game with the one-upsmanship never ending. Started with 650 and then one gets an 850 so another goes 900 then 1,000, 1,200 with the "King" now running 1,800cc. On the roads we travel not one of them can legally ride faster than my 250 does. I get to deal with flicking a 326 lb bike around winding curves and such while the "King" has to deal with a bike that is almost half a ton. It is not much fun dealing with a half ton of bike bogged down on a soft shoulder or pushing it back out of a parking space that had a bit of a downhill incline to it. Pull off on a beach with the "King" and we all have to offer him assistance at one time or another.

Many Burgman riders have gotten over being the "King" and really enjoy riding a well balanced highway competant 400lb 400cc bike instead of one of the 600, 800 or 1,000 lb cruisers.

The Piaggio BV350 can also be a decent highway touring bike with a nice balance of power to weight and efficiency with its boxed stroke engine getting around 70 mpg at interstate speeds. Not something with Super Bike performance but just enough to be comfortable.

[prodigit]

I have a Honda Shadow, VT750. Many times I felt the urge to get The V-star 950, but in the end, I'm glad I did not!
Just by changing the rear sprocket from 41T to 38T, essentially improving MPG by almost 10%, while lowering RPM also by almost 10%. The bike becomes so much more rideable in the city; however due to having only 5 gears, not 6, I find it not pleasant to ride over 50MPH, eventhough the bike goes now near to 110MPH (only tried once, @102mph tops, but I did not have the space to fully try out at top speed).
Unfortunately I missed the opportunity to change the rear sprocket to 36T when these sprockets where available.
But if they ever become available again, you bet that I will invest some money into that.

The VT750 engine, has it's optimum torque in the lower region (Between 2 and 3,5k RPM).
In 5th gear, goes about 50MPH @3k RPM. The bike can go to 7,5k RPM, but I don't like to push it too hard above 3k rpm.
I so much wished I had an extra gear, going in 6th, I'd probably be able to go 65MPH @3k RPM.
Such a bike would feel so much better on the highway, eventhough power to overtake other cars is reduced with the extra gear.

[rockynv]

Jan 17, 2013 0:25:37 GMT -5 prodigit said:

I have a Honda Shadow, VT750. Many times I felt the urge to get The V-star 950, but in the end, I'm glad I did not!
The VT750 engine, has it's optimum torque in the lower region (Between 2 and 3,5k RPM).
In 5th gear, goes about 50MPH @3k RPM. The bike can go to 7,5k RPM, but I don't like to push it too hard above 3k rpm.
I so much wished I had an extra gear, going in 6th, I'd probably be able to go 65MPH @3k RPM.
Such a bike would feel so much better on the highway, eventhough power to overtake other cars is reduced with the extra gear.

With 4,500 rpm to spare you put the taller gears in and downshift when needed. Unless the other cars are all Testa Rossa's and Diablo's I don't see what the problem is with your 750 or any 400 designed for highway usage.

Even my 250 has enough headroom to deal with most regular passenger vehicles and trucks on the interstate.

With a redline of 7,500 my inclination would be to go with 2/3 to 3/4 so somewhere around 5,500 to 6,000 rpm as my prefered limits.

If I did upgrade to a motorcycle it would probably be an Aprilia Mana 850 which would do well against the Ferrari or Lamborgini up to about 120 or so despite its CVT design. Still comes in fairly light for an 850cc bike at somewhere around 450 lbs. Only around 50 lbs more than the Burgman.

Have to deal with a bad left leg from a ladder accident that crushed my left knee, ankle and heel also taking out the cruciate ligament which makes shifting difficult now.