|
Post by leeinark on Mar 10, 2011 15:53:53 GMT -5
Guys I need a little expert advice. As you might know I put a new digital voltage gauge on the trike. When I crank up and go my voltage is 14.3 or so. Turn the lights on and voltage goes to 12.8 or so and over a period of time (say 30 minutes) the voltage will slowly deplete down to 12.0 or 11.9. I haven't gone more than thirty minutes so I don't know if it will keep depleting. Turn the lights off and voltage immediately shoots up to 14.2. QUESTION: Do I have a problem with my charging system, and if so what is suspect?
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 10, 2011 16:01:42 GMT -5
Leeinark, Sounds like the Regulator/Rectifer is not keeping up with the Demand OR it is getting hot. Make sure it is NOT near the Engine and or Muffler, CDIs, Regulators do not like the Heat. So If it close to someplace where there is a lot of heat Move it.
Mine with the lights on riding registers 14.5 volts. Lefty
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 11, 2011 7:49:40 GMT -5
Ok thx Lefty...that is what I thought but I wanted another opinion.
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 11, 2011 11:31:18 GMT -5
Well I think I do have a charging system that might be breaking down but I don't know. I put the trike out of the garage and ran a high power shop fan blowing cold (54 degree) air right by and thru the CDI and the regulator. Cranked the trike up. In about 2 minutes the voltage was down to 12.0 and pretty much stayed there. BUT when I shut the lights off the voltage shoots up to around 14.3. I can't imagine that my LEDs are pulling away that much power could they? Plus even if they did the stator should be able to keep up. Rapid Jim any comments?? Does the regulator have an adjustment on it like some cars? Any 12 volt regulator should work right? I'm thinking maybe if I buy an adjustable one I could fix this.
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 11, 2011 12:52:59 GMT -5
Leeinark, On the installation of your LEDS do you have a good Ground. Also did you connect the Leds to the Existing Taillight wireing in other Words Spliced into them and connected the Leds wires to them.
I have a Trunk with Lights that do just what yours do. On mine the Spoiler has LEDS running all the way across. When running the Spoiler LEDS SEQ 3 at a time from Center out and when I squeeze the Brake they come on and stay on real bright until I release the Brake. The Leds on each side of the Trunk are Turn Signals when I put my turn signals on they also SEQ Out like an Arrow. Lefty
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 11, 2011 14:57:25 GMT -5
Lefty yes I spliced the LEDs directly into the running/brake system and grounded them with the stock ground that the original equipment light wiring used.
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 11, 2011 16:01:32 GMT -5
Leeinark, Well the only way to find out is Disconnect one at a time a LED group and check your battery and see which one is drawing to much if indeed one of the group of lights are. Lefty
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 11, 2011 16:45:11 GMT -5
Hi lee, sorry to hear about your problem , have you changed any lights like your headlight ? do you have an alarm ? have you added anything electrical ? comming from your stator what color and how many wires are in the plug , not the bullets ? How many pins is the regulator/rectifier ? When all of your lights are on , are any wires getting warm or hot ? John
|
|
|
Post by rapidjim on Mar 11, 2011 17:23:05 GMT -5
No Ajustment on the regulator. Sounds like a possibly bad regulator breaking down as it gets hot.
Jim
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 11, 2011 17:54:18 GMT -5
He had problems with the Regulator before due to getting hot I told him to move away from the engine and or muffler wherever it was. I think he put some type of cover around it to try and protect it from the heat. So I also think the regulator is going south as it get hot. Lefty
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 11, 2011 21:20:03 GMT -5
No alarm. Added an electric fuel pump but it is not the problem. I guess I'll pull all the LEDs and start from scratch to see what changes the voltage to drain with the light switch on. Of co9urse the easiest would be to just change the regulator and see if that might be the problem...I don't think it is getting heat soak though because it is a ways away from any heat source. Plus running the fan across it should have eliminated any added heat (see earlier in the post). No headlight change either. John I haven't opened up the stator so I can't answer your questions on that. I think I'll try a new regulator first.
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 11, 2011 21:44:25 GMT -5
6 and 8 poll stators can be 4 pin regulators the 11 poll will have 3 yellow wires I maybe able to tell you more if you give me a little more .
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 11, 2011 23:50:02 GMT -5
Rapidjim might now how many poles those trikes come with, if not he can make a call and find out. He is a dealer for those trikes so they would tell him the poop. Lefty
|
|
|
Post by rapidjim on Mar 12, 2011 8:29:47 GMT -5
3 yellow wires on stator, 2 plugs on regulator total of 6 wires. If I remember correctly it is an 18 pole stator.
Jim
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 9:54:22 GMT -5
well it looks like three phase stator , how many cc's
this is an interesting one , I would start with removing the fan , next I would start the bike and do a few voltage readings , start the bike and unplug the regulator from the stator and read the voltage from the yellow wires to ground , first at idle then reved up yellow to yellow in all combinations , and do it again at idle and reved up each yellow to ground , it could be one bank of coils is bad . You can not rule out a regulator without proving that it is getting what it should be getting . The ohm check is ok to see if the coils are opened or shorted , but beyond that the resistance will change with coil tempture .
Is the fan on the flywheel ?
|
|
|
Post by Bluefront on Mar 12, 2011 11:59:12 GMT -5
Let's see.....you installed an electric fuel pump on a system that came with a vacuum pump or maybe was just gravity fed? If so.....that's probably the reason the voltage is dropping so low. At a reading of12V with engine running/lights on, your battery is discharging. Apparently many of these smaller Chinese scoots/trikes, have a very marginal charge system. The electric pump simply draws too much current. Anything much over an additional 1.5A current draw.....too much for the stator. I seriously doubt the extra LEDs are to blame.....their current draw is minute. I have tested both my 50 and 150 for their stator output. An extra 20W DC draw will cause a battery discharge on both of them.
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 12, 2011 14:27:43 GMT -5
Ok I guess I need to clarify a couple of things, it's a 300cc. 1) As soon as I start the bike the Regulator is cold I can use the pass switch that only turns the headlights on quickly to pass and the voltage will immediately drop to the 12+ range (from 14.3) 2) With trike running fuel pump on 14.3 on voltage so I don't believe that is the problem. 3) the drop in voltage is directly related to the use of the headlight 4) I have an accessory plug (basically a cigarette lighter plug that is used for my GPS...in use or out of use voltage does not change more than one tenth of a volt. 5) with all the lights on the voltage never drops below 12...but with the lights on you can count on the voltage going from 14.3 to 12.0...turn the lights off and voltage shoots back up to 14.3
TVNACMAN: I'll have to run all the checks you have listed here. When you say remove the fan you do mean disconnect the power to the fan? That is what I assume.
Lastly when I start this trike up it immediately goes to 14.3 volts revved up or idle doesn't matter ...14.3 volts.
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 14:40:15 GMT -5
ok why are you using an electric fuel pump , that pump could be putting you over the edge , ok your not seeing it that way , the fuel pump has a steady draw while it is running (do you agree?) now the lights will need to be on if you take the fuel pump out your going to have power for other things (like charging the battery). to do the checks you can disconnect not remove . when did this problem start before or after the fuel pump ? John
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 14:44:29 GMT -5
do you know the spray dusters to clean your key board (compressed air in a can) I call it blow job in a can . while it is running once the voltage drops turn the can upside down and blast the regulator it the voltage goes back up replace the regulator .
John
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 12, 2011 14:51:18 GMT -5
Ha ha, John I like it. I'll have to go buy one. I did use a big shop fan the other day and with outside air temp at 54 degrees I blew that cold air into the reg/cdi area...NO CHANGE ON VOLTAGE READINGS
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 14:56:53 GMT -5
just a quick thought while it is running with the lights on when the voltage drops unplug the fuel pump ,you should get a few seconds of run time , see if the voltage goes back up .
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 14:58:44 GMT -5
so what part of the world are you in
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 12, 2011 15:01:17 GMT -5
That is a COOL way of checking if it is HEAT ;D Good one TVNACMAN Lefty
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 15:05:03 GMT -5
I think it is the fuel pump putting it over the top
|
|
|
Post by edfr on Mar 12, 2011 15:27:41 GMT -5
Try this place and you can call him and explain your problem, he makes Regulator/Rectifiers that are guaranteed to put out more. He also has how to test the stator and or rectifier/regulator. Lefty www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com/index.html
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 12, 2011 16:46:39 GMT -5
John great suggestion...I'll try that. Lefty thx for the contact! Live in northern Arkansas. Until I put a digital voltage gauge on, never knew I had a problem. It still runs fine just low on voltage. The trike runs so much better and consistently with the electric fuel pump. I see your point on the amperage draw. I hate the thought of going back to the vacuem fuel pump. I guess as long as my battery is staying charged it may not be that big of a deal. Still I will try the pump disconnect to atleast have the potential for solving the problem. Thx a bunch! Lee
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 16:54:26 GMT -5
lefty had his trike moded for a wheelchair rack , putting an extra battery in a trike should be doable .
|
|
|
Post by leeinark on Mar 12, 2011 18:36:21 GMT -5
Ok this is getting more and more interesting by the minute. Cut the electrical line to the fuel pump and put in a quick disconnect. Cranked scooter...14.3 on volt meter. Turned on headlights...12.3. Pulled the disconnect...no change in voltage (well fluctuate 12.2-12.3. Turned off headlights 14.4 volts. So my fuel pump is drawing very little voltage (not sure about amperage) from the battery. Lee
|
|
|
Post by Bluefront on Mar 12, 2011 19:09:48 GMT -5
Hummm.....Did you go to 55w headlight bulbs from OEM 35W bulbs? I remember a post from one guy whose scoot came with the wrong bulbs installed....battery kept going dead.
35W halogen bulbs are available online with a variety of different bases. They usually cannot be found at the usual auto parts stores. Might be worth a bulb swap to see if that solves anything.
FWIW......unless you get a volt reading around 13V with the engine running, the battery is not being charged.
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 12, 2011 20:03:59 GMT -5
ok lets see run it with the lights off so you get the 14.3 and press the brakes . let me know what you get . How many pins is the regulator .
|
|