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Post by skyetone on Apr 21, 2010 21:55:45 GMT -5
 www.youtube.com/watch?v=86EZBAiqhm4&feature=relatedThey are starting to pop up around the west here. Got a couple leads on some killer deals for one. One is four fifty without any title with one mile. I don't know anything about these. tech pages say 150cc blocks. GY6? too good to be true.... anyone??? |
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 22, 2010 0:37:00 GMT -5
Skyetone,
Personally, I love these things, but they're not for everyone. They usually sell under the trademark "Scorpion". They are usually 200 cc (NOT a GY6) but a Lifan vertical single with either a 4 or 5 speed transmission. Apparently they have at least a 3 valve head, as the single cylinder has dual exhausts. They have a nice "bark" to the exhaust! This same engine is found on many Chinese motorcycles.
The styling is fabulous, a copy of one of the bikes that won one of the "Biker Build-Off" shows. I think the original may have been built by the Martin Bros, but I'm not sure. The only thing that would have made it look even better would be if they had used the Lifan 250 V-twin Yamaha clone!
There are a few on the street around here. Their quality is good, and you just can't stop looking at the doggone things! Some come "potentially" titleable, some don't. Some need speedo, lights and turn signals added, and, of course there's always a hassle getting something like that registered, but somehow persistence can get it done in most states. Worst case scenario, you can probably title it as a "home-built vehicle".
On the downside, they are a true motorcycle, NOT a twist 'n go scooter. So you have to accept clutch and gears. They are a "hard-tail" with absolutely NO rear suspension, even in the seat. THAT is a BONE-JARRING experience. Trust me...
They have only about 3" of ground clearance, making it impossible to navigate speed bumps without destroying the frame finish. (A skid plate might be added inconspicuously under the frame...) That is also a problem in most areas. They were never meant to be street-licensed, but they are so INCREDIBLY beautiful, and, they will cruise 65 mph with a top end of around 75 mph... So owners just HAD to attempt to street-license them. Some dealers list them as street-legal, some list as off-road only. They have a lot of drawbacks, but DO THEY TURN HEADS... YOU BET!
They are nearly useless for passenger carry also, since the stylized rear "fender" has no top... Be ready for the classic Harley chopper "skunk stripe" of road schmutz up your back... LOL! It would be hard (though not impossible) to set up a passenger seat without ruining the cosmetics. They DO look better though with the huge plastic side pieces removed. They have a jackshaft from the tranny to the rear wheel and the setup looks sweet exposed.
If you have a "Jones" for a WILD chopper, and don't mind a nightmare registering it, AND don't mind riding solo, AND your butt getting sledge-hammered with every tar strip, AND you can figure out a way to ease it over speed bumps... You might just love it!
You can get them new, delivered for under $2 grand, and used ones are dirt cheap, usually because the owner found it was hard to title, and rode like a marble on glass. To many riders, those problems are nothing compared to the fun of pulling up anywhere on something THIS exotic!
From watching videos of them, they seem to have plenty of giddyup to pull smoking donuts on asphalt, and will go down the road pretty fast. Lots of fun for the money, but with NO features scooter lovers want. I cut my teeth on a hard-tail Harley chopper, so I know what it's like to put up with their faults.
Heck, TRY it... If you don't like it, you can probably get most of your money back by re-selling it!
Whatever you decide, ENJOY!
Leo in Texas
PS: One of these would make a SUPER trike, with the independent suspension from an ATV grafted on!!!
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Post by skyetone on Apr 22, 2010 12:37:42 GMT -5
yea the ground clearance freaks me out and I'm biulding sunl chopper and it's LOW. wonder if with a bigger rear fender if you could put a bigger tire on it. they are comin. just like scooters. Just got to give it time and see what happens...
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 22, 2010 19:20:11 GMT -5
Skyetone,
WOO HOO! I hadn't realized you're the one building the Sunl chopper! (I'm gettting old...). I'm a dyed-in-the-wool chopper fan, and, before seeing your Sunl custom, I would have positively said it's not possible to make a scooter into ANYTHING resembling a chopper and have it look good.
I'd have been WRONG!!! You have the "eye" not to mention the tools and talent to do just that. After seeing what you did to that Sunl, PLEASE get the Scorpion and have at it!!! Revise the rear fender (?) it's only side trim anyway, re-angle the rear hard-tail for a little more clearance... Maybe cut the frame down-tube in front, and take out a few degrees of rake for more front ground clearance...
Change the diameter of the wheels if you want, motorcycle wires would look good, though the wheels on it are sharp. Make the rear fender solid tin, with a strong sissy-bar/fender brace, slap on a sprung solo-seat and passenger pillion pad and you'll be good to go!
The fact that the tranny is connected to the rear sprocket via a jackshaft allows infinite gear changes to accommodate a larger diameter wheel if desired. (You could even graft on a Harley rear-end clip and 15" wheel...) Heck, even fab up a mono-shock for the rear end and get some spring in there... The possibilities are endless with this thing, once you get it to "bare bones"... They have really nice custom paint, but, after cutting and changing it will need paint anyway... BLACK! Red rims, and whitewalls... I do get carried away with other guys builds... Sorry!
Am I excited about what you could do with this one? OH YEAH!!!
After seeing what you did with the Sunl, which should not make any kind of "chopper" but you did it anyway... I can't wait to see what kind of toy you could make from a Scorpion! And, it would be highway-capable to boot!
Sure hope you do it, and BEST of LUCK in the build!!!
Leo in Texas
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Post by skyetone on Apr 22, 2010 23:46:41 GMT -5
wow i'm blushing. I guess a few people do follow the chopper. ,I have done so much lately it's sick. I lost out on the cheepo one I had a lead on. 450 but was thinking about the small mono springs they have and a wishbone setup to make it spring. should I post new pick of the chopper. I think I'm done building. now it's fine tuning and performance.....
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Post by Jake aka: Ventoscoot on Apr 23, 2010 0:10:32 GMT -5
I saw it in aciton tonight, and it is SICK!!!! ONce he gets some electrical gemlins worked out and our custom exhaust, it sill be definately rockin!
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 23, 2010 12:19:18 GMT -5
Sorry you missed the cheap Scorpion... That would have been a really affordable start!
I just got to thinking... With your tools and ability, you might pick up a 250 V-twin Lifan motor/tranny. They're often on eBay brand-new for less than $400. Then, just build your bike around that, using forks, wheels, etc. from whatever source you can scrounge.
You might end up with something like the "Hardknock Kikker" bobber, only a lot slicker!
A lot of us dawgs and dawgettes are watching now!
Leo
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Post by skyetone on Apr 23, 2010 18:43:42 GMT -5
never heard of that motor. scary to think scoots is my first relm into two wheels. i'd really like a shifter. suicide shifter is sick in my eyes. I bet i'll end up with a scorp before too long... future thread commin.....
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 24, 2010 0:57:28 GMT -5
never heard of that motor. scary to think scoots is my first relm into two wheels. i'd really like a shifter. suicide shifter is sick in my eyes. I bet i'll end up with a scorp before too long... future thread commin..... Real Harley hard-tail stying, and quite the "old-school" bobber. They come basic with a small horizontal 100 or so cc motor, but upgrades include the Lifan 200 cc vertical single... AND they ALL have suicide hand-shifts... Here are some pix I found of the Hardknock Kikker. Here's the 200 cc version (similar engine to the Scorpion)...  Here's a concept with the Lifan 250 V-twin. This place sells the V-twin engine separately for customer installation... It makes a nice bobber, about the same size as the old Harley "45" flathead...  Originally, these bikes had some really bad complaints about the factory-direct sales and service. Now that they're being marketed by regular dealers, that may not be a problem anymore. Enjoy... Leo in Texas Like the Scorpion, they're not for everyone, but they look good, and will clear speed bumps! Might as well check them out... some guys are putting in the Lifan 250 V-twin, and then they REALLY look authentic. Leo in Texas |
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Post by skyetone on Apr 24, 2010 9:28:39 GMT -5
the way you talk it sounds like someone still sells this style of bike? if you look here www.thehorsebc.com/index.html they actually have a readership that basically builds whatever they get there hands on. just starting to read it. but it's cool. I sent em a e-mail about mine seeing how "liberal" they really are LOL |
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 24, 2010 14:25:02 GMT -5
Skyetone,
These bikes are DEFINITELY alive and well, and being currently manufactured. Look on the Internet under "Hardknock Kikker" "Kikker 5150" and you'll find several dealerships selling them. These pix were from "Go Karts USA". They also list a slightly more expensive similar bike as the "Heist Bobber". Not familiar with that one at all.
They come either ready to title and ride, OR in kit form (I think you'd like that) so you can build it the way you want. Then, you can specify paint (if any) wheel type, front fork type, tires, engine, etc.
From what I've read, they were originally sold only "factory-direct" and had a lot of complaints. Now, they must be up to speed on production since reputable dealers are listing them as available.
The basic bike comes with about a 100-110cc (Honda 90cc style) engine/tranny. Pretty anemic, and looks STRANGE in a bobber frame... But the Lifan 200cc single looks British, and fits the frame well.
The Lifan 250 V-twin is the hot setup though... The V-twin completes the chopper/bobber illusion to perfection. I don't think anyone yet offers the V-twin as a finished bike, but this Go Karts USA offers the engine/tranny as a separate item. (You can also get the engine/tranny on eBay for around $450.)
I would think you could order the Kikker bike from a dealer, complete DELETING the engine/tranny and add the V-twin to your order, or, buy the engine separately. The whole enchalada should not run more than maybe $2,000 to $3,000 which is in line with a modest 250cc scooter. Quite a lot of bike for the money! (And FULLY equal to a forties/fifties Harley bobber in both appearance, and performance.) Building an authentic vintage Harley would cost you well over $10,000 and not have the reliability of the Chinese engines.
And you design and assemble this bike yourself for that pride of ownership you get from an original build. It's still a hard-tail, but set up for a sprung solo seat which makes the ride bearable. Heck, ALL bikes were made like that at one time "back in the day"... I put a half-million happy miles on hardtail choppers in the sixties!
It's about as opposite from a scooter as a bike gets... but it's got a lot going for it! Would I build and ride one? YOU BET! IF I didn't have a bad back... and IF I had an extra 2-grand in my pocket... LOL! Considering that I do have a bad back, and I don't have $2-grand to spend, I'll happily poot around on my lowly GY6... Twenty years ago, I'd have latched onto one of these in a heartbeat!
Check it out and see what you think... You can also find many videos of the Kikker in action on the net. From what I gather from your posts, it may just be what you're looking for.
Ride safe,
Leo
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 27, 2010 1:38:44 GMT -5
Quick update on the Kikker...I just checked out the GoKarts USA website, and as of May first, the small engine Kikker will remain the same. HOWEVER, the 200cc upgrade will have a bigger frame, and the 250cc V-twin will bolt in. The 250 V-twin will be an available option as of May first, and that will be a VERY attractive bike for $3 grand! Definitely a sweet, shiny alternative the fan-cooled GY6 "twist-n'go"! You get to design and build the bike YOUR way, and OOOH, that beautiful V-twin cackle echoing through a set of shotgun straight pipes!At around 20 hp, and 75+ mph speed, this will be a virtual modern-day rebirth of the forties' Harley 750cc "45" cubic inch hardtail. The all-time classic bobber raw material! BUT with ultra-modern Yamaha technology. VERY interesting to be sure!!!Leo PS: Wouldn't this motor/tranny setup be the bomb, perched in place of the "floor-board" of a GY6 scoot? All the area where the GY6 motor USED to be could house oil tank and/or extra fuel. Make up a simple rear trailing arm pirated from a wrecked cycle, with disk-brake and chain/sprocket drive and you're good to go. Instant V-twin scooter with clutch and five gears! AND 80 mph speed.
Chairman Mao, are you listening?
Life is good...
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Post by skyetone on Apr 27, 2010 13:30:17 GMT -5
retro is sexy. I'll keep it in mind. But money is tight. I've only got a few hundred under mine after purchaes. Most stuff lived in my shop from other projects... someday though...
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 28, 2010 13:05:05 GMT -5
I surely DO understand!
It takes me months just to save enough for a few parts... The best part of these scooters is making the most of what you have! If you just stick with the custom you're finishing up, you'll have a head-turning creation to enjoy for years! When you get the engine finished, it may just be pretty quick, too.
Just yesterday, I met a fellow on a scooter at "Wally World". It was a 260cc made by Xingyue (never saw one before, and it was VERY nice, with good fit and all white pearl factory paint) and he was particularly interested in my 150 because it was made by the same guys... You just don't see many Xingyue scoots around.
I was hauling home a bag of cat food and liter on my scoot's floor, he was hauling a bag of dog food tied on top of his scoot's HUGE trunk, and liked the way my 150's flat floor allowed unlimited (well, almost!) stacking up of crap... LOL! He likes to cruise the freeway at 70+ mph, and take 100 mile trips though, so he wasn't so enthusiastic about the 150cc top end...
This rider just sold his house, car, and his Harley trying to stay afloat in this economy, and picked up this 260 scooter used, and CHEAP, just to have something to ride. He really likes it, and was happy to meet another scooter-jockey. Of course, I enlightened him about this site, and the others. He has yet to REALLY learn about Chinese scooter "habits"... However, he got it cheap because the carb was trash, and it was basically useless with only 500 miles on the clock. He adapted a Harley pumper carb he had on hand, and has it running like a bandit, so he's learning FAST!
Being a long-term Harley rider myself, I can agree with him that these scoots cost about the same as insurance alone, on the Hog, and are still about 90% as much fun! Not a bad deal in anyone's book...
Keep up what you're doing! I think you're doing it pretty well indeed!
Leo in Texas
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Post by skyetone on Apr 28, 2010 18:08:47 GMT -5
yea gonna go work on the scoot soon. almost done. I want to ride next week..
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Post by hotrodscoot on Apr 29, 2010 23:56:15 GMT -5
i was looking on craigslist today and there was one of those bobbers for sale for 2300. they look very cool!!
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Post by eagle150 on Apr 30, 2010 2:21:45 GMT -5
i was looking on craigslist today and there was one of those bobbers for sale for 2300. they look very cool!! They are very slick. I've seen a couple on the road. Originally they all had the same frame (very similar to the old Harley "Hummer"). and were available with a 100-125cc Honda 90-style flat single cylinder engine. That looks a little "strange" to say the least. The only upgrade was the Lifan 200cc vertical single cylinder. That engine/tranny looks quite good, filling the frame, and looking very "British". Like a vintage Triumph hardtail. Starting next month, the 200cc upgrade will have a slightly bigger frame, and, the Lifan 250cc Yamaha V-twin clone will be a drop-in third-level upgrade. This bike should be wonderful, a near replica of the forties/fifties Harley "45" flathead. They come as a "kit" and you can specify fork, wheels, tires, paint, engine, etc. At $3,000 plus a couple hundred shipping, they are not cheap, BUT still in the ballpark of a good Chinese 250 scooter. They're easy to assemble, and should make truly driveable showpiece. For about one-tenth the cost of building a Harley bobber, you can have a mighty nice ride! Cheap to maintain and insure... Gotta love that!Leo |
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Post by barnone on Feb 2, 2011 14:05:11 GMT -5
How about this one?   I ordered one from www.extremescooters.biz/250cc-street-legal-bobber-chopper.aspxin flat black the other day. EDIT::::::::::: Canceled my order and opened a dispute with PayaPal when another company called me asking for payment. Vince 2005 Yamaha XT225, 2009 Qlink XF200, 2008 SYM HD200, 2007 SSR SR125BMW, 2008 Pitster Pro Classic 125 |
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