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Post by ptglass on Aug 5, 2008 23:08:22 GMT -5
This is a promotional video put out by Lance Powersports. Although I found the presentation misleading and downright humorous, it does show us how these bikes are assembled. About 18 years ago I lived in Japan for 3 years. I toured a Honda motorcycle factory there and I can assure you that it was nothing like this factory in China. Now I can understand why there are so many small problems with the scoots they produce. Take a look here: www.truveo.com/150cc-scooter-Lance-Powersports-Factory/id/1509040358 |
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Post by mortar235 on Aug 6, 2008 1:41:20 GMT -5
old
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Post by kink on Aug 6, 2008 8:07:59 GMT -5
I hadn't seen that before. It was pretty cool, but I basically just skipped through with no sound (I'm at work). I'm going to try and watch this again tonight properly.
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Post by scootinpicker on Aug 6, 2008 8:21:55 GMT -5
I'm particularly impressed with the inventory management system on their parts.  Bud |
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Post by kathygnome on Aug 6, 2008 8:35:14 GMT -5
I have no idea what they were thinking of with that video. If it was to make me more confident in buying a Chinese product, it was an epic fail. Nothing automated. Everything seemed to be very haphazard.
A couple of things really stuck out. The dunking the thing in water for a pressure test and it doesn't stay under long enough for the bubbles from plunging it into the water to subside really made me wonder how helpful that possibly could be.
I'm sure a lot of this is normal for any factory, but it's not what you show in a video if you want to impress people. You show a guy being absolutely diligent in that pressure test--maybe film until he rejects one. You show the technology. You don't show parts sitting outside on open palettes in the rain.
I've been agonizing between a Qlink Siena from a local motorsports dealer or a Buddy 150 from a dedicated scooter shop a few hours away and this really put me off of Chinese scooters.
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Post by ptglass on Aug 6, 2008 12:57:36 GMT -5
kathygnome:
I feel exactly the same as you after watching this video - what were they thinking? I've been agonizing over buying a Chinascoot for over a month. The quality control issues really worry me and this video didn't inspire a lot of confidence. The problem with a better quality Kymco or Japanese scoot is the cost. I will probably go that route or possibly buy a used small Japanese motorcycle. I have a motorcycle license - anyway you need one to ride anything over 50cc.
I'm hoping that the Japanese big 4 will start importing some nice scooters and small displacement bikes from their factories in Asia (Thailand, Vietnam, Indonesia and the Philippines. This may just be wishful thinking on my part and won't do anything for the immediate situation.
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Post by "Big Guy" on Aug 6, 2008 13:25:06 GMT -5
...You don't show parts sitting outside on open palettes in the rain... Ah, but you missed the background in that scene... there was a ten foot pile of frames that looked like they were dumped from a dump truck on the ground! I guess that was the staging area before they are loaded onto the roller racks ;D -Rich |
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Post by malport on Aug 6, 2008 13:48:59 GMT -5
See, this is what happens when you look behind the doors at your favorite eatery and see how they "prepare" your food...naw, just eat it and quit worrying...what you don't know can't hurt you, right?
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Post by voodoosix on Aug 6, 2008 14:53:00 GMT -5
seen it before.... that dude is a tool, he talks to the camera like actually at a Lance owned factory or something. he's just a middle man pushing the same thing that other companies buy from Znen. he reminds me of the local factory outlet furniture or car salesman on annoying tv commercials. guy looses all credibility when he cant pronounce "Lambretta". the "Lance Powersports Factory"? not. that's Znen and Lance only sells 9 of the 1st 24 scoots in the 1st line up and of those... 5 were the same model. i'd be ashamed to show a pile of cardboard boxes as my spare parts inventory. they show off the frames in the rain like its something to be proud of. in case you ve missed it here is part 2, can you count the number of times he says "high quality"? www.truveo.com/scooters-150cc-lance-Powersports-factory-part-2/id/1336053273uh... each engine is tested at wide open throttle for 30 minutes in front of a floor fan? so much for heat cycles during break in. hey! at least he says they dont used cheap Chinese batteries! and dont miss the highlight of the video... the Lance Powersports Cafeteria! |
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Post by mchlwise on Aug 6, 2008 15:40:27 GMT -5
 I wasn't surprised or disturbed by anything in those videos (except for the obnoxious host). When I bought my Roketa, I knew I was buying a cheap Chinese scooter, put together basically by hand on an unsophisticated assembly line in a hurry. I like the restaurant analogy. I didn't go to a steakhouse and wasn't expecting prime rib cooked by chefs in clean white uniforms with tall hats. I got a quick burger at a corner dive, so I'm not surprised to see the cook wipe his hands on a dirty apron - so to speak. You guys worrying about quality - if you want BMW level manufacturing, you ain't gonna get it in a $1,500 Chinese scoot.  If you're not willing to take a chance and have to work out some of the bugs yourself, you should spend the money and get something higher on the manufacturing totem pole. I've had to work out a few bugs on my scooter, but I'm still very happy with it. The key is realistic expectations.
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Post by Bake is Back on Aug 6, 2008 16:01:09 GMT -5
mchlwise, you are 100% correct. Just wish the others thought like you. I am not a scooter mechanic yet, so I can't afford to have mine worked on. I need it every day. I paid more and have high expectations, but I now want to get a cheap scoot so I can spend some time and learn how they run and how to make them run.
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Post by Karl on Aug 6, 2008 16:15:09 GMT -5
I'm particularly impressed with the inventory management system on their parts. Bud LMAO! I was thinking the same thing, Bud. "Uh, Jin, would you go and get me a 10mm bolt. It's in the box with the open top.....oh wait, that's all of them!" Karl |
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Post by Karl on Aug 6, 2008 16:18:53 GMT -5
...You don't show parts sitting outside on open palettes in the rain... Ah, but you missed the background in that scene... there was a ten foot pile of frames that looked like they were dumped from a dump truck on the ground! I guess that was the staging area before they are loaded onto the roller racks ;D -Rich LOL! Rich, I saw that, too! I think they were giving them the "final rinse". Karl |
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Post by Karl on Aug 6, 2008 16:35:57 GMT -5
uh... each engine is tested at wide open throttle for 30 minutes in front of a floor fan? so much for heat cycles during break in. V, I think that they're following the ChinaMotoman break-in method. ;D Karl |
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Post by lancecharming on Aug 6, 2008 17:58:29 GMT -5
And that`s the BEST scooter factory in China! The idiot says they have the parts. Unfortunately they can`t FIND them because they`re stacked randomly...  But seriously, the Lance scooters are very high quality compared to the other Chinese scooters. Mine and my girlfriend`s have run like Swiss watches without a problem, unlike a lot of the other Chinese scooters out there. I wouldn`t buy a Kymco just becasue of what I saw in this video. My neighbor has a Kymco that he paid 2 1/2 times more for than I paid for my Chinese scooter and it`s already giving him problems. And I talked to a friend a couple days ago who has a Vespa that he paid 3 times more for than I paid and at 300 miles parts are already breaking on it.  And I wouldn`t worry about the line not being automated. That means they`re being hand-assembled like a Ferrari and not stamped out like a Hyundai. The hand-made cars always seem a lot better than the mass-produced-by-robot cars. They need to get a better host for the videos,though. At least one who can say "Lambretta". |
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Post by sandman on Aug 6, 2008 18:14:59 GMT -5
I agree... that host was obnoxious. he seemed incapable of speaking without gesticulating wildly and leaning in towards the camera like some shady conspirator. Plus, I think I saw several of the line workers seriously considering punching him in the jaw. He'd just come right up behind them and get in their workspace all while staring at the camera and completely obivious to the fact that the guy's $.10 an hour depends on putting on at least 150 cylinder heads an hour.
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Post by lancecharming on Aug 6, 2008 19:41:17 GMT -5
He reminds me of the guy on TV trying to sell you a miracle mop or magic picture hangers...
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Post by mortar235 on Aug 6, 2008 19:51:10 GMT -5
But seriously, the Lance scooters are very high quality compared to the other Chinese scooters. How many other Chinese scooters have you had to compare it with? |
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Post by scooterollie on Aug 6, 2008 19:56:11 GMT -5
Many folks don't understand production in China today. Many steps that would be automated in plants in the U.S. are not in China, not only because of cheaper labor but because they need to put multiple millions of people to work. In China, they don't won't to automate too highly!
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Post by malport on Aug 6, 2008 19:56:56 GMT -5
Naw, he's that Billy Mays character who gets all worked up and yells at you to buy some Orangeglow cleaner..."but wait, there's more..."
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Post by dean on Aug 6, 2008 19:59:04 GMT -5
Keep buying their stuff....that'll show 'em!
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Post by pspock on Aug 6, 2008 20:05:44 GMT -5
There is nothing wrong with buying a chinese scoot... as long as you're willing to do the quality control on the product yourself. When you get your scooter, make sure you (or someone else) does a full PDI on it.
What bothers me about this video isn't what Lance showed. I know that's what the chinese factories are like. The real problem in that video is the fact that Lance actually charges hundreds of dollars more for their scooters than other chinese brands selling the exact same thing, yet nothing in the video justified why. The only difference between Lance and the other China brands is the the sticker they put on the final product. And honestly I didn't see one darn thing in that video that would equate to Lance proving "added value" over the other China brands (other than all the sales guy talk the guy did in front of mountain of crushed parts boxes on the verge of an avalanche).
This video does nothing to hurt the reputation of China scooters. But it really hurts Lance's reputation, as now people considering them have to wonder just what exactly the "added value" of paying hundreds of dollars more for a Lance really is.
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Post by dean on Aug 6, 2008 20:30:35 GMT -5
There is nothing wrong with buying a chinese scoot... as long as you're willing to do the quality control on the product yourself. When you get your scooter, make sure you (or someone else) does a full PDI on it. Agreed. My real point is: given what you say and how it goes with the points between the pdi and the factory, including accepting smashed shipping crates and half demolished scooters on delivery, how can anyone really complain about what the factory looks like or what the out-of-work-actor-brother-in-law of some importer says? |
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Post by tscoot on Aug 6, 2008 20:33:11 GMT -5
wow a little cramped there huh,and yes that latest technology in parts proliferation is awesome,and how bout letting mother nature acid wash all them frames lol ;D |
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Post by rherald2 on Aug 6, 2008 21:32:46 GMT -5
wow a little cramped there huh,and yes that latest technology in parts proliferation is awesome,and how bout letting mother nature acid wash all them frames lol ;D because they want to add the classic look or maybe more easier for you to check for cracks in the welds |
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Post by thedannymullen on Aug 6, 2008 22:27:31 GMT -5
Actually that factory was cleaner and more organized than the one I have visited that built dodge trucks in Mexico city...
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Post by madmanjustice on Aug 6, 2008 22:30:28 GMT -5
i love the end of part two with the text....
"do your homework, and dont settle for....."
then it cuts to http://www.awesomebuggy.com...lol
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Post by kaintuckdave on Aug 7, 2008 8:46:07 GMT -5
Just watched part one so far, but they really needed to hire a video director, editor, music guy and especially a narrator who's not on crank. Some of the edits made me dizzy, those slow pans in dead silence don't fit with the parts with sound and it's just disjointed as hell. The camera guy wasn't bad if a real film editor had put the thing together. I made way better shorts back in school (it was 16mm film in those days) and I was just a kid.
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Post by dorian on Aug 7, 2008 10:56:30 GMT -5
Many folks don't understand production in China today. Many steps that would be automated in plants in the U.S. are not in China, not only because of cheaper labor but because they need to put multiple millions of people to work. In China, they don't won't to automate too highly! Bulls-eye! I don't have a problem with hand assembly production lines, and of course they look less perfect than a robotic assembly line. |
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Post by ptglass on Aug 7, 2008 12:05:28 GMT -5
Earlier in this thread I posted that I wish the "big 4" Japanese motorcycle companies would start importing small bikes and scooters from Asia, especially Thailand where I have first hand knowledge of the quality of the units. Well it turns out that they are already doing it. They just need to do more. I was visiting a Kawasaki dealer the other day and he informed me that the Kawasaki Eliminator 125cc bike is indeed made in Thailand! That explains why it is the lowest cost motorcycle being offered by a big 4 in the US. Check one out sometime and take a look at the quality - it's excellent! That is if you can find one - they sell out almost instantly around here.
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If you're not willing to take a chance and have to work out some of the bugs yourself, you should spend the money and get something higher on the manufacturing totem pole. 
