Dollar-For-Dollar best 250cc Scooter......

[scootermikie]

Feel free to briefly list the pluses and minuses. Please mention total miles vs problems and the price you paid if you so choose. Thanks for participating.

[scooterlizard]

I know this is not a 250, but with my experience with majesty has been great. The Yamaha Dealer that I delt with has been good to me. To me the morphous would be a good start to learn on and have trouble free performance as well. They are pricey for most people but you have to figure on "well if I go cheap how much repair will I do later or pay a little extra for a little more quality and reliability". But it boils down to preference on the buyers behalf. Beauty of the scoot is in the rider's wallet.

Scooterlizard

[Gary]

Well, I'm going to have to put in a vote for the Viva 250. For well under $2K, quite a deal. Sure, I've had a few problems, but for the most part they've been relatively minor and easy enough to correct. The scoot runs great, handles fine, is fun to ride, and easily meets my needs for a daily commuter.

I'm sure the Kymcos, etc are better quality, but they are easily $2K to $3K more expensive than my scoot. So dollar-for-dollar, the Viva seems pretty hard to beat.

Some caveats:

• I've never ridden anything other than a china-scoot, so I don't know how much better riding a Kymco, Honda, etc really are. Maybe if I tried a Kymco, I'd find they are worth the price.
  
• I've got tools and just enough mechanical know how to get by making small repairs (which my Viva has required lots of!). I'd never recommend a Viva or other china-scoot to someone who either doesn't have the skills to do minor repair work or doesn't have the inclination to do them.
  

[scottfla]

Well, in my opinion, the Kymco People 250 ($3999 MSRP) is pretty much near the middle of the price range, between the Chinese 250's and the big name scoots (over 5,000 for a new Reflex) and the performance, warranty, quality pushes it very very close to the most expensive 250cc scooter, so it gets my vote.

[WarrenS]

A used Honda Helix. I heard of a guy who has over 130,000 miles on his. On a dollar per mile basis I think it is hard to beat. ;D

[monty57]

Although I have since purchased a new Majesty, the Roadrunner 250 TLX I purchased this spring is still running and I have had none of the major problems like charging, cooling, electrical, not running, etc. I starts good, runs great and drives good. My major complaints are the rattles and chasing loose screws. As I said before the main reason I purchase the Majesty was for interstate riding. I still take the RR for a sentimental ride almost every weekend. In general, I think most of the Chinese scoots are great bargains if you really look at the mechanical marvels you are getting for less that 2K!

[oldscooterguy]

I'm with Warstein. There are literally thousands of 1985 Honda Elite 250's and thousands of 1986 Helix's still on the road. And seeing them over 100,000 miles isn't unusual.

Lets see how many other 250's are still going strong 22 years later.

And finding used ones with low mileage well under 2K is a common occurance.

[gusset]

I also agree that a used Honda 250cc scoot just might be the best bang-for-$$$.

However, if you're talking brand new bikes, my vote goes to the Daelim S2 250.

I could be accused of cheerleading for my own choice in scoot. However, in my opinion it is dollar-for-dollar the best value out there:

1) Quality scoot...just maintain it and ride it. It's the equal of the 250cc Kymcos in terms of reliability, build quality, and performance. No tweaking required at start of life, and mine is now turning over 10,000km with zero repairs needed; nothing has broken.

2) Reasonable price ($4000 range).

3) It doesn't have folding mirrors or a digital dash, but it does have something that, IMHO, makes it a better value than one of the fine Kymco scooters: superior legroom and comfort, especially for taller riders.

[automattic]

Kymco People S 250. Great style and quality.

[Gary]

I must add that if (or is it when?) I get my next scoot, it will probably be a Kymco People 250. Thet are beautiful machines and I like the bigger wheels.

[scottfla]

Well, I was thinking of new, since you really can't generalize used scoots, everyone has heard stories of the guy that bought a 2005 Honda Reflex with only 200 miles on it for $500. Of course that would be the best bang for the buck.

I still think the People 250 (in red, if you must know ) is the best, because for $1200 + less than a Honda, you get the performance and reliability.

[WarrenS]

I still insist the Honda Helix Is the best. I owned one for 18 years. I never had to take it in for anything. I maintained it myself. I sold it for $1,000 and could have gotten more for it. I paid $3,000 in 1988. It is also a very comfortable ride. It fits people with long legs and short ones. I talked to the guy who has the one with 130,000 miles on it.

[scootermikie]

Thanks to those that took part in this poll. Kymco appears to be the choice so far. Next Spring when my wife and I look for 250 scoots it will probably be either a Bandit 250 or a Kymco. We'll wait til more scooterheads vote on the poll before making our final decision. Thanks again!

[tastroman]

As far as finding a used 250 Elite in good condition for less then 2g, good luck. (at least in my neck of the woods. Va.) Another problem with 250 elites is that a lot of the parts for them are no longer manufactured.
When my 250 elite was ready to be put to rest (46,000 miles) I went with a Daelim s250. It has a Kymco engine and drivetrain so should be on par with Kymco. I only have 1800km on mine so I really can not attest to its long term value.

[johnnyscoots]

Although I have the Kymco, I'm gonna agree and say that the Helix is probably the most bang for the buck 250cc out there. I've seen many of them, and their reliability has long been touted to be the "Movie Monster" kind of reliability: the damn things just won't die, no matter how you try to kill them! Leave them outside uncovered, put thousands of miles on them, they still run strong. I went to my first rally a couple a weeks ago, and a 16 year old kid had a red one "Probably the last one I'll need". I just wish the styling wasn't so, "Hey, I'm a child of the '80s". I can probably guarantee that the crankshafts on the Helix won't break down after 2800 miles!!!

John

[brycegtx]

The way I see it, the best of the best is the Suzuki Burgman 400.
The next best is the Yamaha Majesty 400.

To me, Kymco Xciting 250 and Honda Reflex 250 are a tie

And The Roketa MC-54 250 is next
Other MC54 look alikes are next.

All other chinese 250s are last.

I think the Japanese scoots are the best. I don't view the Kymco as the best, but it seems to be priced almost as high. I like the Honda Reflex styling, but it has a carb. The 400s are just a bit more in price, but they are sooo much nicer. And the quality of the Burgman seems better than any.

Now what is the best for MY dollar?

My wife will probably only put maybe 1000 to 1500 miles a year on her Scoot. If the MC-54 lasts 10,000 miles, it could last her 10 years. Since the MC54 engine is basically a helix engine. And from what I have read, the problems with these scoots has little to do with the engine. Most problems come from electrical and carbs. I don't see a problem with the MC54 lasting as long as any other if I keep up with it.

The MC54 seems to be much higher quality than the typical Chinese scoot.

For these reasons, I think the Roketa is the best dollar-for-dollar for me.

If my wife ever gets to the point where she wants to put more miles on the scoot, I will get her a Burgman 400.
Bryce

[howlnwoof]

brycegtx said:

The way I see it, the best of the best is the Suzuki Burgman 400.
The next best is the Yamaha Majesty 400.

To me, Kymco Xciting 250 and Honda Reflex 250 are a tie

And The Roketa MC-54 250 is next
Other MC54 look alikes are next.

All other chinese 250s are last.

I think the Japanese scoots are the best. I don't view the Kymco as the best, but it seems to be priced almost as high. I like the Honda Reflex styling, but it has a carb. The 400s are just a bit more in price, but they are sooo much nicer. And the quality of the Burgman seems better than any.

Now what is the best for MY dollar?

My wife will probably only put maybe 1000 to 1500 miles a year on her Scoot. If the MC-54 lasts 10,000 miles, it could last her 10 years. Since the MC54 engine is basically a helix engine. And from what I have read, the problems with these scoots has little to do with the engine. Most problems come from electrical and carbs. I don't see a problem with the MC54 lasting as long as any other if I keep up with it.

The MC54 seems to be much higher quality than the typical Chinese scoot.

For these reasons, I think the Roketa is the best dollar-for-dollar for me.

If my wife ever gets to the point where she wants to put more miles on the scoot, I will get her a Burgman 400.
Bryce

Interesting assessment. I would have put the list in exactly the reverse order of yours, but I am not saying you are wrong. We just have different priorities. I place a lot is importance on price and less on reliability. I assume the Chinese stuff if going to be full of bugs but once they are worked out, I don't see much difference in technology.

Good luck on your Burgman . . . It looks like a great ride!

[WarrenS]

Often a cheap item will cost more in the long run. Besides I enjoy riding more than fixing. Where I live we have winter so I don't want to spend the best days fixing my scooters.

[howlnwoof]

...like I said, it is a matter of priority. You have the money and not enough time. I have the time but not enough money, and in this case I am pretty sure I will never spend thousands of dollars fixing my scooter. I am willing to turn wrenches for the savings.

[Gary]

There is no right or wrong answer here. No doubt, more money should bring more quality and fewer problems. But if you can get over the initial qulaity issues, I think the China scoots provide quite a bit of bang for the buck. It took me a few months to get over the hump, but now with about 5,000 km on the scoot it seems to be settling down to just a great reliable little ride. I lost a few days of riding fixing things (not many) but learned a lot doing my own repairs. For the most part it was kind of fun ... but that's just the way it was for me and it may ot be true for others.

[WarrenS]

You seem to think that I bought more expensive scooters because I have more dollars than sense. The real reason is scooter riding is a high priority for me. My scooters are my car. I have a car that is 15 years old and has less than 20,000 miles on it. People who say they can't justify paying that much for a scooter usually are not serious riders. I have been riding for more than 50 years and it remains my main means of transportation. If I thought there was a better scooter for my purposes I would get it.

[scootermass]

gusset said:

I also agree that a used Honda 250cc scoot just might be the best bang-for-$$$.

However, if you're talking brand new bikes, my vote goes to the Daelim S2 250.

I could be accused of cheerleading for my own choice in scoot. However, in my opinion it is dollar-for-dollar the best value out there:

1) Quality scoot...just maintain it and ride it. It's the equal of the 250cc Kymcos in terms of reliability, build quality, and performance. No tweaking required at start of life, and mine is now turning over 10,000km with zero repairs needed; nothing has broken.

2) Reasonable price ($4000 range).

3) It doesn't have folding mirrors or a digital dash, but it does have something that, IMHO, makes it a better value than one of the fine Kymco scooters: superior legroom and comfort, especially for taller riders.

I like Daelim as well. Why do you think the Daelim S2 250 is so reliable? The S2 250 engine is a re-badged Kymco. Yes, Daelim doesn't make their own 250cc engine yet. Plans for 2009 from what I understand & they will be making themselves.

I think Daelim is an excellent scooter company, but I hesitate to claim they are better then Kymco @ this point. Couple of reasons.

1. The dealership network isn't mature enough yet.

2. Relying on Kymco & others for larger cc scooters. Hence, not being a "trailblazer"

3. Price. Yes...They are just about as much as a Kymco (or very close) Why not buy a Kymco vs. Daelim? Kymco has a much more proven track record.

In the end, if you have a Daelim dealer closer by, then I say "By all Means" If not, Kymco is the answer.

Alex

[gusset]

scootermass said:

1. The dealership network isn't mature enough yet.

2. Relying on Kymco & others for larger cc scooters. Hence, not being a "trailblazer"

3. Price. Yes...They are just about as much as a Kymco (or very close) Why not buy a Kymco vs. Daelim? Kymco has a much more proven track record.

In the end, if you have a Daelim dealer closer by, then I say "By all Means" If not, Kymco is the answer.

No arguments at all on the dealer network...If you don't have a dealer, then you can't consider buying one.

I have never tried to talk someone out of buying a Kymco; I've endorsed them on any number of occasions, both online and in person. Kymco makes great bikes.

I myself set out to get a Kymco when I was ready to buy. There was a reason I didn't follow through, though. After sitting on and test riding some Kymcos, I found they didn't give me a comfortable seating arrangement for my big feet and longish legs. It was after this that I learned about Daelim. Same price/quality value proposition, but with a definite advantage in terms of roominess.

I'm not trying to steer anyone away from considering a Kymco. However, dollar for dollar, given equal fit/finish/quality/performance, the best bike has to be one you can comfortably sit on. Hence my vote.

[howlnwoof]

warstein said:

You seem to think that I bought more expensive scooters because I have more dollars than sense. The real reason is scooter riding is a high priority for me. My scooters are my car. I have a car that is 15 years old and has less than 20,000 miles on it. People who say they can't justify paying that much for a scooter usually are not serious riders. I have been riding for more than 50 years and it remains my main means of transportation. If I thought there was a better scooter for my purposes I would get it.

No, Warstein, I think you bought a more expensive scoot because your PRIORITY is reliability/dependability/quality . . . and that comes at a price. It is worth it to you; it is not worth it to me. I am NOT a serious scooterist and never will be. I just want a cheap bike that gets me to and from work, the store, etc. I live in a "car city" and I will always drive a car for safety reasons.

Your question was "what is dollar-for-dollar the best 250cc Scooter". If you would have asked "what is the best value in a dependable, high quality scooter", then I would have agreed with your assessment.

You and I have different priorities. I don't think you have more money than sense any more than you think I have more time than sense.

[T W I S T E R]

value is in the eye of the beholder, your dealer, your money available, your scooter needs, your ability and patience to get under and fix, your fear of being stranded 50 miles from home, your dealer support from the mfg, and on and on and on.

what sold me on the kymco 250s was the 16 inch wheels, seat height, windshield and reputation for quality, leg room and looks. price didn't enter into it.

the reflex may be a better scooter but i didn't like the small tires and the low to the ground ride and the hump down the middle. also, options for the reflex are few and way overpriced.

buy what you think is best for you and your situation. when you have a choice always go for the best you can afford at the time.

[jollymon]

Not sure if this is the right forum for this, so, at your discretion moderator.....

I will be purchasing a 250 scooter(s) in the next 90 days. I intend to beat the living piss out of them. I am an ASE Certified Master mechanic, and have owned MANY motorcycles in my younger days, so a complete tear down and rebuild is no problem.

What I will be doing with the scooters is, well, attempting to bring back the Good Humor man. I will be running scooters with a sidecar on ice cream routes, and (in my younger days) had experience with this using a 650 Yamaha. They held up well, and have done the calculations to make sure the 250 scoots can handle the weight.

Now, I have investment money, but not a gob of it. I want to start with three scooters as a base fleet, two with freezers and one set up for a backup. Having read the forums, I will do the gas/coolant/fuel pump/etc mods, as well as upgrades on the electrical and performance.

After LOTS of reading on the forums, (THANKS DAWG!) I am leaning toward the Roketa MC-54B. I don’t expect these to last forever, but parts availability are a real concern.

So…open season on scooter opinions…would like to hear from the high mileage crowd, and those who are admittedly hard on their scoots.

Thanks Guys and Gals!!

Happy Scooting

Jolly Mon

[hillbilly]

That is an interesting idea you got there jollymon. What sort of miles do you anticipate you will run each week doing that?

Since you are a tech then you are in a good situation to look at a used Helix that you could keep going a long time. With the track record of the Honda scoot it would be my choice for commercial use.

[scooterollie]

Jolly Mon;
Welcome to the Dawg Pound. For a question like this, it is probably best to start a new thread in this section.

Another choice for your consideration is the Linhai 300. It is built by a Chinese firm called Linhai and is marketed around the world as the Linhai Mainstreet. In the U.S., it has also been named the Aeolus 300 and the SuperStrada 300. The company partnered with Yamaha in the 1990s and builds some products for them. The engine is a 275 cc Yamaha based design and the scoot is very much like a few year old version of the Yamaha Majesty. I have had one since late July and another member here, Bikernuc, has had his a few weeks longer. I also have owned three other "Roketa" brand Chinese scoots assembled by two different Chinese companies. The Linhai is different. The entire scoot is made by Linhai, not assembled with parts from many different sources. Linhai has benefited from their association with Yamaha as the quality of design, materials and construction far exceeds the other scoots I have had. Here is the link to my thread in this section: scootdawg.proboards59.com/index.cgi?board=200cc&action=display&thread=1185566326. I purchased mine drop shipped from John Dikov of Valley Scooters. Here is the link to his site and the SS300: scootersus.com/stradascooters.html. Don't know where you live but there are also some "Brick-n-Mortar" shops selling the Linhai 300. Not as many of these scoots around because they were originally marketed last year for much more money - $3500 - and most folks passed them up for the CFMoto/Honda engines scoots for around $2K. Hope this helps.

[hillbilly]

Does sound like a nice possibility scooterollie.

I could see how a little extra torque and weight of one of those might be nice with the sidecar.

I haven't ever worked on one of the Linhai engines but Stan Jessup mentioned in one of his posts that they were easier to work on than the cfmoto engines so I guess that means pretty darn easy.

[WarrenS]

I found this one
icecreamtrucks.com/2002_icecreamscooter.shtml