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Post by Parker2100 on Aug 25, 2012 21:07:35 GMT -5
Removed the left, rear wheel of my trike to investigate a strange sound. Found that a large nut was loose (but still held in by a Cotter Pin) so I remove the hub assembly, lubricated with White Lithium Greese, tightened and reassembled the hub and wheel.
The sound was probably caused by 2 washers between the nut(nut holds on the hub) and the hub clanking together because there was a little extra space.
Sound is gone for now. Expect it to come back though because I did not Lock-tight the nut. And especially since I greased everything - including the threads.
Maybe there should be a third washer?
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Post by ibtrikin on Sept 1, 2012 9:35:34 GMT -5
Maybe. They get loose periodically. Also, if you ride for too long with your wheel a little loose you run the risk of ruining the bearing. I'm having to replace one now(2300 miles) due to this. I might have overtightened the castle nut at some point too.
The point is: Check your castle nuts regularly. Get them tight, but not so tight as to ruin your bearings. Once tight, the castle nut should line up with the holes in the axle where the pin will actually go THROUGH the slots on the castle nut. If not, tighten a little more. If the nut is behind the holes when tightened, add washers to bring it back out. One member on here mentioned torquing his castle nuts to 90 ft/lbs then tightening a little at a time until the holes lined up with nut. I think that's pretty good advice.
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 2, 2012 2:30:14 GMT -5
That is valuable information IBtrikin. Thank you! My trike now has 420 miles and I have been riding it for little over a month (mostly after I got my endorsement).
Curious, what noises did your bearing make before and during its failure?
Parker
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 2, 2012 19:37:24 GMT -5
Ah! Just read your discription of the problem. Yes, I remember the familiar squeeling sound on my old cars.
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Post by ibtrikin on Sept 4, 2012 18:13:06 GMT -5
If you roll your scoot and hear a clicking type of sound at the wheel it's the ball bearings and your bearing is going south. When it starts squealing it's shot.
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Post by olmanrivah on Sept 4, 2012 23:35:32 GMT -5
The point is: Check your castle nuts regularly. Get them tight, but not so tight as to ruin your bearings. Once tight, the castle nut should line up with the holes in the axle where the pin will actually go THROUGH the slots on the castle nut. If not, tighten a little more. If the nut is behind the holes when tightened, add washers to bring it back out. One member on here mentioned torquing his castle nuts to 90 ft/lbs then tightening a little at a time until the holes lined up with nut. I think that's pretty good advice. Remembering when I use to work on cars, You torque the nut and then back off 1/4 turn or where the pin will go thru the Castle nut. This way the bearing is not under pressure, but, is snug enough to spin properly. This is the reason for a Castle Nut and not a Lock Nut. |
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 5, 2012 2:50:37 GMT -5
It has clicked since day one. Took wheel off several times. Each time the Castle Nut was loose. Each time, I tightened the Castle Nut and the sound went away. Yesterday I noticed it again very faintly. The Castle Nut was slightly loose. Tightened it and this time I lock-tite'd it. No sound. I don't know but I am seeing cause-effect here.
If it is bad bearings, why would the sound go away? Not saying it isn't but I am commited to this thing and would prefer it not to be the bearings.
Olmanrivah: Don't know but I don't like that sound and it goes away only when the Nut will not turn anymore with normal torque. The pin fits perfectly when I tighten the nut. It fit into place before also even though there was a little play. Seems like the more play, the louder the clicking. Again, I see a cause-affect relationship. Perhaps I want to see cause-effect, but da facts is da facts, I am not imagining it.
Parker
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Post by ibtrikin on Sept 6, 2012 16:37:49 GMT -5
I think I'm gonna go to Lowe's and find a bolt that will go through those holes and bolt it in. No matter how you line up the castle nut and pin it, it will always loosen up some.
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Post by fido64 on Sept 7, 2012 15:20:14 GMT -5
Consider this may be it is not he nut loosening up just maybe it is the bearings or linkage that is comeing loose// stranger things than that have happened to a trike//FIDO
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 7, 2012 17:42:34 GMT -5
Yes, it is possible but really, this is the only thing I can do anything about. The clicking (or clanking, with the fender on) is gone for now and I tighted up the other side (which was also loose and was starting to give a little feedback) for good measure.
Seems to me the linkage would stand less of a chance to come loose if everything was snug.
IBtriken: Probably right. Then I will have to do it again. I even locktite'd the washers together so they cannot tumble or clank against each other or the hub.
So now everything is lubed and tight (hey, that sounds dirty) and no more sounds.
Parker
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 9, 2012 11:13:54 GMT -5
Been a few days & still no clicking/clanking.
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Post by olmanrivah on Sept 9, 2012 14:07:52 GMT -5
Once the cotter key is in the Castle nut, it ain't movin'. The slack is toward the bearing or not tight on the other side.
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Post by Parker2100 on Sept 11, 2012 17:14:02 GMT -5
I meant I tightened the other wheel omr. Still not hearing clicking/clanking in either wheel after I tightened and Locktite'd the Castle Nuts and washers.
On the IB Viking the Castle Nut definitly does come loose. I don't like it loose. Its not ok with me.
I'm sorry, did I imply that I was afraid the Castle Nut was going to come off? I didn't mean to do that.
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Post by Parker2100 on Nov 3, 2012 21:55:59 GMT -5
Update. Still no clanking. No problems
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Post by fido64 on Nov 23, 2012 15:46:38 GMT -5
How a about a up date on the noise //I believe I am getting the same stuff//Fido
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Post by Parker2100 on Nov 23, 2012 20:04:30 GMT -5
Mostly gone away. Starting to come back just a little (nowhere near the same though) but probably time to tighten things again. I've ridden it at least 500 miles with no clanking after I did this the first time.
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Post by jazzman on Nov 23, 2012 20:55:20 GMT -5
If you take the hub off you will see a rubber dust cover, pull that out. Behind that about 1/4 inch from the edge you will see a "C" clip that sits in a Grove built into the Axle Tube. That "C" clip if you have a NONE upgraded Axle is the ONLY THING that keeps the AXLE from actually coming completely out, wheel, hub and castle nut and all. Now between the "C" clip and the Bearing is oh maybe 1/16 or so of a space. So you have to tighten the HUB so there is no play between the HUB and the Spacer washer which is NOW riding on the side of the Bearing.
Now IF YOUR axle did NOT come with a FLOATING RING On both sides(UGRADED AXLE) to stop the AXLE from moving out what can happen is the AXLE will move out and now there will be a space between the INside of the Castle nut and hub. Then because the end of the AXLE has a little taper to it the HUB now moves up and down on the axle and is not grabbing the SPLINES really good and it will ruin the Softer Splines on the HUB, because the Hub will be slipping on the splines on the axle.
If you want to see all this and learn more about your Trike axles visit ScooterD0c and or ScooterPr0fessor he is on both forums and ask Alleyoop he is the Trike Guru and will set you straight with the Straight axles on the 50s and 150s. He has pictures of the axle and the parts inside. Can tell you the bearings in there and sizes and also what is in the Differential and how it all works.
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Post by Parker2100 on Nov 23, 2012 22:22:31 GMT -5
That is useful information Jazzman. Thanks.
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Post by Parker2100 on Nov 29, 2012 14:12:35 GMT -5
Just a quick update. Got in and inspected the gear splines on my axle. It looks good so I re-tightened everything and put the wheel back on. The slight sound that was coming back is gone. Everything seems good.
Wish I took pictures so everyone would know what we are talking about but keep forgetting.
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Post by fido64 on Nov 29, 2012 16:14:25 GMT -5
Do you have the old type axel or the new one? All i need to do to mine is torque the nut to 45/50 ft.lb and it is quiet for a while but it comes back//FIDO
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Post by Parker2100 on Nov 29, 2012 18:11:11 GMT -5
I am not sure what I have (new or old). Whatever is on the 2012 PST150-8 Viking. I also don't have a torque wrench. I just make it tight and use some Loc-Tite. I also enlarge the head of the cotter pin that holds the Castle Nut so that it completely fills the slot and has nowhere to move. Also, there are two large washers that I apply Loc-Tite between so that they don't move independently and clank together (that is my theory of what makes the thunking/clanking sound). Of course, the washers can only clank together if there is a little space.
I debated securing them because I figure the clanking would tell me when it is getting loose. But I just hate that sound!
Parker
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