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Post by jake318 on Feb 1, 2009 14:07:48 GMT -5
Harry I dont think JR is BSing . Im just comparing apples to apples . His performace was abnormally low for the model. His Increases are far and away above the norm for a 150cc gy6 going from14 to 13 or any increase in a 150cc model . Who has gotten better bottom end , more pulling power AND 8mph on top end ?... What im saying is that something was wrong to begin with he was doing 40mph up a hill and 52? top speed . Normal is 50 up a decent hill and 60 top end .. roughly . If you read Drierdans original posts and JRs they are VERY similar and it ended up being clutch plates sticking . . I have no problem with roller weights I tune my rollers also ... Harry we actually agree on the matter( I see you recomending 12g) . I just warn people on the 11g rollers holding the tranny in low range Especially if they installed a 1500 contra spring and worse yet if they do more mods without changing the 11g weights out .... ie too many rpm + too much heat= fried engine . Im sure JR cleaned / greased his plates . And the problem does reoccur at least he has a starting point . Jake
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Post by harrywr2 on Feb 1, 2009 15:15:02 GMT -5
jrryan is at 2200 feet...he pushing 6% less air then someone at sea level. Aerodynamic Drag is geometric rather then linear.
So if I want to match my powerband to my V-Max...which will be at least 6% lower then jrryan due to aerodyanmic drag then my weights need to be roughly 6% lighter then jrryan all other things being equal. .06 * 13 = .78 So I want to drop just shy of a gram from what jrryan is at. Which brings me to 12 Grams at sea level.
If I ride up to 2,500 feet with 12 grams weights I will have a lower top end then jrryan because I will be overshooting my powerband.
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Post by JR on Feb 1, 2009 17:34:07 GMT -5
Jake my belt is the 835, don't ask me why they put it on rather than the 842 but it would make a tiny bit of difference and I reported 6 to 8 mph because with my lard butt on it she was around 6 but my wife is very little so much she tucks under the windsheild and she said hey it goes 10 mph more but I split the difference at 8mph you know how women are LOL. Also when I did my test the day before I had not checked the valves on this scooter at all. While I was waiting for her to get off work I did a valve adjutment also that I did forget to mention and the intake was bad tight and then she got home and off we went. We went up this big hill right outside of town 3 times, twice with her in the lead and once with me in the lead and she was riding up my butt on my 250-B and it used to be I had to always either slow way down or wait on the top for her but no more. I really can't say if the valve adjustment really made that much of a differnece but maybe a little because before the roller weight drop it ran great also. It would really bogg down in the hills. The tach doesn't lie I recorded the rpm 3 times before and after with all results practically the same. Ain't going to get in the there is no way argument, to each his own but wiil say hey Jake some said that all you was doing was a waste of money and no way but not me, I first said it is your money and if ya want to sit on the porch and burn it then so be it the money is yours and that's your right and also didn't doubt your speeds and mechanical skills, non what-so-ever so just give me the benifit of a doubt. The belt was in good sahpe and the variator was clean and not gummed up and I as I said did no guessing went and had the old ones weighed and they looked good scooter has 985 miles on it. Hey ain't nothing wrong with being cheap, just gives you more for fishing, gambling, cold beer, and gas for my scooter!! LOL I like to call that hood ornament of your dad's a bargain JR
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Post by JR on Feb 1, 2009 17:40:40 GMT -5
P.S. Jake I live in Arkansas not Texas that dang place is flat what they call a hill we call a bump. LOL BTW this particular hill I,m talking about is one dang good hill, will have to get the uphill grade, someone ran over the sign, but from the bottom to the top on the south side is 1 1/2 miles not your average hill and we ride a lot in the Ozark mountains so I had to do something to help momma stay up JR
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Post by jake318 on Feb 1, 2009 17:48:03 GMT -5
JR my car 89 caravan is SO worn the engine taps like a diesel counless miles , took engine out of junkyard and put in chinese cast iron pistons (yes cast iron!! ) o I know cheap... what im sayng i their had to be something other going on other than wrong rollers NO ONE GETS 10MPH TOP end from rollers and more power uphill AND better acceration I DONT THINK YOUR BSING im saying there was something else . HEL i wish you could get all that from rollers LOL> Jake
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Post by jake318 on Feb 1, 2009 21:08:42 GMT -5
Read the other post on this topic they get bottom end or top end and no where near the improvement you have stated . jake
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Post by scootskinner on Feb 1, 2009 22:12:56 GMT -5
Jason318 why don't just back off and leave the man alone? Heck go back to your thread where you have to spend enough money to buy three scooters with your kspowersport company and stay away from all the poor old folks who like to do things simple and as cheap as they can afford. Sounds like you needed to learn from your dad.
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Post by jake318 on Feb 1, 2009 23:37:27 GMT -5
I STARTED OUT POOR BUT FORTUNATLY DRIVE AND INTELEGENCE CAN MAKE ONE SUCCESSFUL IN AMERICA . OBVIOUSLY YOU HAVE NEITHER AND ENVY IS UGLY. I HAPPEN TO LIKE JR . BUT IF I MYSELF WAS THINKING THAT A PART SOLVED A PROBLEM AND IN FACT WAS SOMETHING I DID BY CHANCE , THAT NIGHT WELL REOCCURE I WOULD WANT SOMEONE TO POINT IT OUT . MORE THAN LIKELY THE PLATES WHERE STICK AS DRIERDANS WHERE . IF IT DOES HE HAS A PLACE TO LOOK. OR HIS FINDINGS WHERE MISCALCULATED ONE OR THE OTHER . WHAT HE IS STATING IS IMPOSSIBLE IF HIS MACHINE WAS RUNNING FINE . ... DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT IM SAYING !!!
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Post by jake318 on Feb 1, 2009 23:50:31 GMT -5
iF jr was close I would give him the dam parts . jake
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Post by scootskinner on Feb 2, 2009 11:07:21 GMT -5
Poor, poor Jason all that money and still don't understand. Who really cares, and if you go read JR's statements again you will see he said 6 to 8 and his wife said 10mph but he doubted this himself. From what I have read that the average rpm gain is 500 rpm with every gram of drop in the roller weights and he reported 400 rpm sounds believable to me. On this thread several have stated that when they dropped the rollers down a lot the engine screamed, that simply means to me a lot more rpm. Were you there when he did all of this? Jr seemed to me to take his time and really do it right and so what maybe something else was wrong. Maybe he jarred something loose when he took it apart, who cares? All of the stuff he said about checking it all out and not guessing just made good common sense to me and if I ever try to do this I will take some of his advice. But now you on the other hand, you had to throw in all this that's impossible this and impossible that and all but said the man was crazy or lying. There have been some here who have read all the so-called improvements of yours but just said hey, what a go man! and left it at that. Why couldn't you even had done that for JR ? Just said Hey good for you man!!! JR also stated that he wasn't trying to get more speed but more climbing power up the hills where he rides and that the top end was just a pleasant bonus, at least that's how I took it.
Started out poor and made it big, well I'm truly proud for you. That's what living in this country is all about and a person can make whatever they want of themselves but it sounds like to me you need to remember when you were poor, it always seems to have a humbling effect on how you treat and talk to other people. As it stands the way I see it you talk to people now like they're beneath you, money does that to people sometimes. For me it's simple WHAT A GO JR!!!!
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Post by stradarx150te on Feb 2, 2009 12:21:55 GMT -5
Hey I think this thread was just about What size weights you use and how it turned out. Who Care's If you have the money for upgrades or not. Everyone has there own style of doing upgrades. ANY WAYS GOOD JOB TO EVERYONE WITH THERE UPGRADES!!!!!
NOW BACK TO THE TOPIC
WEIGHT SIZE
HOW FAT ARE YOU
THE TURN OUT
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Post by jake318 on Feb 2, 2009 15:56:53 GMT -5
Scootskinner Im glad JR changes worked out... I hope his wife bike works as well as it does now for anouther 30,000 miles . Scoot have you ever fixed your car and thought .. hey that was the problem! only to have it re occurer a week or two later ? his wife bali was slow for its model , with the same set up his was 8-10 mph slower that anouther Bali 150 . Same situation with Drierdans bike . I was being nice to jr and saying if the problem re-occurs look at clutch plates . I like JR he does remind me of my father and we where very close > Jake
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Post by harrywr2 on Feb 2, 2009 20:59:12 GMT -5
his wife bali was slow for its model , with the same set up his was 8-10 mph slower that anouther Bali 150 . jrryan's bali came off the assembley line same month as mine. My stock weights are 12 grams..his were 14 grams. |
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Post by stradarx150te on Feb 2, 2009 20:59:13 GMT -5
So how do you know what your stock weights are like i went to the post office and weighed my weights. The scale said 1.360pounds That would be 589.67grams / 6 = 98.28 So what would my stock ones me. Unless the scale wasn't right?
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Post by harrywr2 on Feb 2, 2009 21:07:12 GMT -5
So how do you know what your stock weights are like i went to the post office and weighed my weights. The scale said 1.360pounds That would be 589.67grams / 6 = 98.28 So what would my stock ones me. Unless the scale wasn't right? 28.3 grams to the ounce. 6 10 gram weigts would be 2.12 ounces 6 12 gram weights would be 2.54 ounces 6 14 gram weights would be 2.96 ounces. The scale at the post office isn't that accurate...so weight 6 at once cuts your error. |
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Post by JR on Feb 2, 2009 22:26:05 GMT -5
Harry is right and for me I was lucky because just a month ago they got a new scale at the post office here and so that's why I went to our local post office. I weighed all mine one at a time and they all recorded 1/2 ounce and all 6 together came out to 3.1 ounces. I know some guys invest in a good digital scale and if you're gonna play with these some then that's a good thing but since I just planned on doing this once I figured the post office scales were close enough. But I think some of the UPS and Fed Ex people actually have scales that weigh grams, don't quote me on that being for sure but I did hear it so that might be another source for weighing your rollers. Problem is in this country we all still use the standard weights, measurements, etc whils all the other folks elsewhere are metric. I don't know if Wally World sells digital scales or not but if they did ya might sneak in your weights and tell them you're just testing their scales to se if they're accurate. LOL
One thing that I mentioned before and you can read it a lot and that's they do put different things in the same scooter and it's just hard to ask someone else to really know a prime example Harry's Bali came with a 842 belt and 12 gram rollers and my Bali came with a 835 belt and 14's JR
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Post by 2btiger on Feb 2, 2009 22:42:50 GMT -5
So how do you know what your stock weights are like i went to the post office and weighed my weights. The scale said 1.360pounds That would be 589.67grams / 6 = 98.28 So what would my stock ones me. Unless the scale wasn't right? Isn't the decimal point in the wrong place? 1.36lbs = 617g's; 617/6=102.83 per roller-> WRONG. Move the decimal point and 0.136lbs= 61.7g's 61.7/6= 10.283g per roller. ie. he has 10g rollers. Maybe  ? Perhaps ? huh Tiger. |
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Post by stradarx150te on Feb 3, 2009 8:31:02 GMT -5
Im going to go and put one roller on the scale and see. But if thats true then when i drove it home from buying it stock i got a max speed of 55MPH
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Post by JR on Feb 3, 2009 9:18:51 GMT -5
What scooter do you have stradarx150te?
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Post by 2btiger on Feb 3, 2009 11:59:42 GMT -5
Hummmm maybe a............................. stradarx150te perhaps ? ? ? ?
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Post by stradarx150te on Feb 3, 2009 12:43:24 GMT -5
Yeah i think i have a strada rx150te But that could just be my name lol Yea so my stock weights are 11grams That's crazy. Unless the post office scale is messed up i need to find a pot head that has a scale, Then i would know for sure I wish i new that befor i got the 11gram sliders Now i will have to get the 12g or 13g just to see!
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Post by JR on Feb 3, 2009 12:59:02 GMT -5
Ok ya got me on the scooter us old folks are a little slow sometimes! LOL 11 grams Wow! It's probably right, the post office scales are probably not off enough to make a full gram of difference because I asked our post master if they ever have their scales checked and in my state all scales have to be recertified once a year, so it maybe the same where you are at. When weighing things and charging people for postage they have to be pretty close just like the ones they weigh food with and sell to people. Do you have a tach on yours, at 11 grams I bet the engine is hitting some high rpm. Don't know if I would want to drop the weights or not, all depends on the engine rpm. Like Harry said if you go past a certain point you gain nothing but will work the engine to death. JR
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Post by stradarx150te on Feb 3, 2009 13:50:23 GMT -5
Yea i really haven't got a chance yet to take her out to see! The only time was driving it home from buying it and then the other day But that was with the old stock carb and stock clutch. Plus it was freesing out so i turned around. Im hoping this weekend to take it out. its going to be in the 40s so should be nice. Then im going to be doing the big bore kit and the 60mm crank. Hoping to be done by april.
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Post by vin150 on Feb 3, 2009 22:27:29 GMT -5
I put 11g rollers in my scoot about a month ago. It definitely improved the acceleration from low to mid range. Please tell me I am not going to burn up my engine. I can still get between 55-60 mph depending on wind (as long as my fuel starvation problem doesn't rear its ugly head)
I don't have a tach yet...guess I should look into that...
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Post by jake318 on Feb 4, 2009 3:59:13 GMT -5
VIN try 12g , you still get the added acceration and your tranny gets into high range . As far as starvation try gravity feed and petcock . Jake
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Post by harrywr2 on Feb 7, 2009 21:00:34 GMT -5
Bike Bali - MC-13-150
Rider weight 200
Test 835/842 belts and weights 10,11 and 12 gram on a long moderate grade(1-2%) and long severe grade(11%).
Worst performance was with 10 gram weights and an 835 belt. 45 on moderate grade and 35 on severe grade
Best performance was with 12 grams weights and an 842 belt. 47.5 on moderate grade and 37.5 on severe grade.
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mao_red
Junior Dawg
Bestar Fox 150 ala PGO TRex ^_^
Posts: 6
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Post by mao_red on Feb 25, 2009 21:30:33 GMT -5
scoot: China scoot Bestar Fox 150 (PGO TRex look)
rider weight: 54kg
stock weights size: 14g straight
size replaced with: current setup = 3x12g + 3x10g, Racing Variator, 1500rpm Center/TOrque Spring, 1500rpm clutch spring, Lighten Magneto, Racing CDI...stock pipe.
recently, i have tested this setup on our long ride...smooth on take-off..easy to reach 60-80kph..I got a 110kph topspeed i think at about 7000-8000rpm or more.
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Post by 150cckiller on Apr 12, 2009 16:27:13 GMT -5
heres the set up i did on my sons SunL 150cc gy-6 atv, blue cdi box no limiter, orange hotter coil, 30mm carb, 300mm intake, intake port plastic gasket port matched to intake, uni filter with 5" long intake tube, straight shot silencer, we did 10g dr pully sliders, yellow main spring (1500rpm) and yellow clutch springs (1500rpm) variator comes in hard, good takeoff he is 75lbs soaking wet lol..it hangs the front wheels from a standing start holeshot on a 300lb quad, power improvement is like night and day
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Post by moot on May 1, 2009 10:17:06 GMT -5
installed a koso sport variator today with some 12g rollers and all is well. can't really comment too much on performance as the carb needs tuning and it's raining here so I can't try to get a top speed run today... it also bogs out in the mid range right now  . Fitted: exhaust, air filter and variator/weights and there's a fair bit more power there, probably going to need to go up in jet size though, I'm only using a 115 atm. |
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Post by donwil on May 2, 2009 16:14:19 GMT -5
Im new to scooters, so this may be a stupid question. Is there a difference between rollers and sliders? |
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? Perhaps 
Roketa MC-60 
Tiger Cub
. 