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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 13, 2009 2:41:06 GMT -5
I have a 150cc scooter with a 157QMJ motor. www.roketa.com/product/2610/0/39626.shtmlI hooked up an HID kit that I have but for some reason it didn't work. They didn't turn on at all. I triple checked the custom wiring harness from the battery. I even connected them directly to the stock harness (Cut plug) and they didn't turn on. I double checked and made sure that the wires are connected correctly. I also tried them on my car and they work fine. Anyone have any ideas why? I used this kit on my last scoot and it worked great. |
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Post by leo on Jan 13, 2009 5:41:35 GMT -5
did you turn the key and headlight switches on?
is the battery connected and charged?
have you tried to run the bulbs directly from the battery?
is the wire you are using a large enough gauge?
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Post by phaze on Jan 13, 2009 9:23:57 GMT -5
man i gotta give you credit, i thought the motor was enough of a challenge lol. i hate electrics good luck
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 13, 2009 13:37:34 GMT -5
did you turn the key and headlight switches on? Yep, I turned the scoot on, and the headlights automatically turn on. is the battery connected and charged? Yep. The scoot was on.  have you tried to run the bulbs directly from the battery? Yes, I used a custom wiring harness that gets power directly from the battery. is the wire you are using a large enough gauge? Yes, i don't remember the exact gauge, but I used the same harness on my last scoot and it worked fine. I also tried another harness and it didn't work. |
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 13, 2009 13:38:48 GMT -5
man i gotta give you credit, i thought the motor was enough of a challenge lol. i hate electrics good luck Lol. Thanks Phaze. I couldn't have done it without the help of Scootdawgs. |
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Post by leo on Jan 13, 2009 13:56:00 GMT -5
have you checked the HID bulbs with an ohm meter? check bulbs out of circuit.
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 13, 2009 15:38:27 GMT -5
after they didnt work on the new scoot did you try them on the car again does the custom wire harness have a fuse or a relay what kind of wiring are we talkin about here? i actually tried mine with the scoots battery before i put it all together on the scoot   sounds to me like it could be a bulb or ballast problem |
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Post by slowscootin07 on Jan 13, 2009 16:44:10 GMT -5
I'd do like scootdoggydog said and test them on your car again. If they work, then maybe you have them wired into the lighting circuit wrong. I know you said you triple checked the wiring, but don't forget that most scooter headlights switch to AC power when running. Also did you check to see if they worked running or just with the switch on??
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Post by 2btiger on Jan 13, 2009 17:16:53 GMT -5
Hey guys, quick question, HID's are on my list of winter projects (last with a wire-harness overhaul) I was under the impression that we needed to have an 11 coil stator to run HID's?
Not trying to hijack you thread Ridd-ick79, but I may be in trouble.
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Post by gy6rocket on Jan 13, 2009 22:46:17 GMT -5
Hey Ridd,
You need to convert the headlamp circuit to DC, then use the head lamp circuit to trip a relay that turns on the current to the HID ballast. It's a relatively simple mod to convert the switch to DC, just need a multimeter and a solder iron and/or crimp connectors. Then wire the relay directly to the battery so the HID ballast pulls from it. The OEM circuit is AC directly from the stator; and is no good to run a relay or a ballast. An 11 pole stator is also recommended because the draw of the HID circuit will exceed the charging capacity of an 8 or 6 pole stator. Don't even try to run 2 HID's from an 8 or 6. Hope this clears things up, I can assist you further is need be.
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Post by jake318 on Jan 14, 2009 0:26:14 GMT -5
Rocket , tiger and earl are the electrical men on the site . If you cant put a wrench on it count me out lol
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 14, 2009 0:36:41 GMT -5
according to the "scoot electrical systems ( must read)" thread scootdawg.proboards59.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=talk&thread=8929&page=3 yes you can use a 6 pole stator if you do some rewiring and get a better regulator Jack - Thanks for your help!! If I understand completely then, the following setup would work for my scooter: Modifed 6 pole stator (per ktm) Trailtech regulator - This would get me to a pure 12 VDC system HID bulbs/system can then be safely used. Thanks! yes that will get you to a full DC setup. you will also have to change where the current lights get their power. you will have to modify the bikes wiring a little bit. its not hard to do. you just need to switch the lighting source from the yellow wire to a switched DC circuit . there are a couple of different ways to make that happen. when you are ready to do it , several people here can guide you Our LF150T-6 should be arriving this week. In following this thread, it leads to a few ?'s. - The LF150T-6 come with two 18 watt head lamps (low/high). Can the HID kits be fitted to this style of scooter without damage from heat, etc (like a 55w halogen) - Also, I'm assuming a 6 pole stator. (does anyone know for sure?) What is the output of a 6 pole stator? - I'm comfortable modifying a 6 pole per the KTM instructions but is the output sufficient w/o adding extra windings? Great forum and information. I ran HIDs on a 6pole stator, it worked but you cant idle for a very long time with the lights on as it will drain the battery. the 6pole stator will have to be rewired with a floating ground and then I am sure it will put out enough juice using the stator you have (modified) w/ the Trailtech regulator is an economical way to get to true DC |
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 14, 2009 4:17:15 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't expect this many replies. To answer a couple questions, I tried them on my car, after trying them on my scoot, and they worked fine. I noticed that my high beam blue light comes on with the switch on both low or high beam, when I hook up the HID's. I was wondering if that meant anything. I think my scoot has an 11 pole stator but I'm not sure. The harness I used has a relay and a fuse. I replaced the fuse, thinking that I might have an invisible hairline crack, and the relay with a new one, but still got nothing. I'm going to try them again with my 14 amp battery in a couple days. I'm currently using the stock 7 amp battery. Could this be the reason? About the AC/DC stuff, I have no idea what the difference is, but I'll read more about it if I can't get them to work.  |
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Post by jamescell on Jan 14, 2009 13:10:02 GMT -5
I installed one HID on my scoot with out any stator mods, and have never had a problem with charging. You can not run your relay off of your headlight circuit with out converting your headlight circuit to DC. If you power your ballast from the stock AC headlight circuit you will toast your ballast! The most simple way to add HID's is to power the ballast and relay directly from your battery and mount a switch to trigger your relay. I went one step further and found a ignition switch wire that has DC voltage when the switch is on, then wired it through one to the kill switch positions. With it wired like this I can never forget to turn the lights off and I can still flash them or leave them off during the day. For day time use I have 3 ultra bright led running lights, they are seen very easily, much easier than the stock bulbs.
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Post by jackthefuzz on Jan 14, 2009 15:59:35 GMT -5
you cant use the scoots headlight wiring as its AC power direct from the stator. you will need to configure the system so its switched using DC power from the battery
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 15, 2009 12:44:54 GMT -5
Just wondering, why did it work with my last scoot? It worked with the harness connected to the battery, and just used the stock bulb wires to use the stock switch. Are some AC and some DC?
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Post by slowscootin07 on Jan 15, 2009 13:08:01 GMT -5
Because not all scooter headlights run on AC. The stator will put out AC and the rectifier switches it to DC, most head lights are run off the stator directly. My HD200 is not the case and is full DC for all the lights. I do have an 11 pole stator and according to the wiring diagram, the head light is run off the rect. and not the stator giving me a true DC headlight, et. all. My XIngyue (tank) is AC head light and will not turn on until it is running and is run off of the AC stator output
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 15, 2009 14:43:28 GMT -5
Makes sense. Mine has an 11 pole stator as well.
Are there any write ups with pics on how to convert DC to AC for the headlights?
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 15, 2009 15:33:07 GMT -5
gy6rocket might be able to help you out there i think hes got an 11 pole stator totally dc system
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Post by slowscootin07 on Jan 15, 2009 16:56:52 GMT -5
Makes sense. Mine has an 11 pole stator as well. Are there any write ups with pics on how to convert DC to AC for the headlights? You DON'T want to do that. HID's won't run off AC and will, as said above, nuke your ballast |
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 15, 2009 16:58:42 GMT -5
i think he misspoke im sure he meant ac to dc
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 17, 2009 4:21:04 GMT -5
Yep. I meant AC to DC. ;D
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Post by gy6rocket on Jan 17, 2009 21:07:03 GMT -5
The conversion is not too hard, most of the circuits on the bike are already 12v, such as the turn signals, horn, basically anything that works with the engine off.
What you need to do is separate the headlights and taillight from the AC side and rewire it to the black wire coming off the ignition. That is a switched 12v wire. It takes some wire tracing and a multi meter, but its not very difficult. Once all your circuits are converted to 12v, its much easier to add things like HID lamps. In my setup I use the headlamp switch (now 12vdc) to trigger a relay that opens and closes the actual HID circuit, wired directly to the battery, fused at the battery. HID ballasts draw a lot of amps when they first fire and will wear out a normal switch pretty quick due to electrical arcing.
SO in a nutshell to move the AC circuits to DC you need to disconnect them from the unregulated AC coming off the stator and connect them to the regulated 12v from the regulator.
If you have an 11 pole stator you will have 3 yellow and 1 green coming from the stator and a 7 pin regulator.
Hope this makes sense, I will add this is almost impossible to do without a multimeter to take readings unless you disassemble the entire harness.
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Post by owenbrau on Jan 18, 2009 8:49:58 GMT -5
What is the advantage to switching to HIDs anyway? Seems like a lot of work and trouble.
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 18, 2009 12:33:31 GMT -5
Have you ever driven anything with HID's? The difference between halogen and HID's is like Night and Day. Also, with stock halogens, cars are always turning right in front of me. When I had HID's cars would wait from like a block away. ;D Here's a comparison of stock halogens and HID's on my last scoot.    |
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 18, 2009 12:38:44 GMT -5
GY6rocket, what is the multi-meter for? So I just need to cut the headlight wires going to the regulator, and connect them to a black wire from the ignition?
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Post by owenbrau on Jan 18, 2009 13:57:50 GMT -5
I'll stick to halogens with a modulator, thanks. That's more visible than a bright light.
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 18, 2009 14:53:38 GMT -5
can you find the 12v wire coming from the ignition if so cut the headlight positive wire and connect it to it
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Post by Riddick79 on Jan 19, 2009 14:32:10 GMT -5
Hmm. I think my headlights are already connected to the switch. They only turn on when the scooter is on.
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Post by scootdoggydog on Jan 19, 2009 16:32:03 GMT -5
if they turn on when you turn the key yes they are but if they dont come on untill you start the engine no theyre not theyre are wired to the stator
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Roketa MC-60 
Tiger Cub
