I really do think that all of us here feel your pain. I sure do feel your frustration on getting a product that did not live up to your expectation. If your intention is to warn other users to be careful on making decisions that one may regret down the road because they will be doing more mechanical work then they anticipated by purchasing a Chinese scooter, I don't think not one person would have disagreed with you. I would think that everyone would have welcomed a personal experience story with an added warning to new riders. I'm sure many would have contributed to your story and your intended message would have been well received and appreciated. So if you really feel that "It's all about the ride", as most of us here do, let's keep it that way. : - )
As an FYI, my Linhai was trouble free until I got to 13K. I then had everything under my seat go bad. I have had few choice words for my Linhai...but I also know it comes with the territory. Happy riding!
I hope that through this thread the "personal story" was relayed. And yes, that was my intention as to warning or giving a heads up to others considering doing what I did with the Linhai. Glad that you got so many trouble free miles with your scoot.
I'm not dissing those who ride Chinese scooters at all in this thread. I feel I got screwed and I'm still not happy about it. The 100 miles I got to ride on the Linhai were great (as long as I ignore the miles pushing the darned thing down the road when it decided to inexplicably die on me). It let me know I could still ride and how much I enjoyed riding.
Therefore I went back to the internet to look for a scoot that would be a more dependable alternative.
I went into the Linhai with info garnered from the internet and this site with the thoughts gleaned that this was the most reliable scoot to be had at the price. Turned out that I was penny wise and dollar foolish. I spent around $3k on a new 300 and ended up spending $5500 on a used Burgie. For $8500 I could have had even more options. I don't make a heck of a lot of money and both of these purchases had me saving pennies and eating peanut butter but they were purchases I wanted to make. I gotta live with my decisions and I still feel obliged to pass along my experience with this particular scoot.
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #63 on Mar 2, 2011, 12:36pm »
im guessing thats not your bergman with stars and such behind it. nice pic... it looks like... A CHINESE SCOOT! sure it might not be, but a scooter is a scooter is a freaking scooter.
o did you join just to bash on chinese scoots? seems like wasted time and effort to me. more waste of time than it would have been to simply fix your linhai...
I have seen the crappy quality of chinese parts in all sorts of places. I will be the FIRST to make fun of the chinese for their quality. but with them its not about quality. its about price. the sooner you realize that, the sooner you will get over your little "china is crappy" hissy fit.
as many have said, they have gotten plenty of trouble free miles from their chinese paperweights. ive gotten a few hundred on my chinese built- italian designed scoot. it cost more than most chinese scoots new, but i bought it used and got a good deal. its a bit better quality, but in the end its simply a pile of parts. what you get in the end depends on the quality of the parts, and the guy who built them.
more often than not, its the guy who built them. it is assumed that the person in china didnt do a very good job, so it is up to the AMERICAN here to fix those mistakes. it sounds like your dealer did not do this very well, if at all. your PDI includes all the bolts, including the ones you cant see or "didnt consider"
any mechanic will tell you your options are: good, cheap and fast. but you only can choose two. you want cheap and fast? it wont be good. want it good and fast? wont be cheap. you want it cheap and good? it wont be fast. china only does cheap and fast. most anyone over the age of 12 knows this. ever had the batteries that come in your chinese toy last longer than a couple days? china simply does what it always has done. pump out volumes of copied parts at a low price.
your bergman will break just like anything else. it will simply be more expensive to fix when it does. will it go longer without breaking? there is no way to tell, or prove that it will. go ride 50k on your scooter and then thumb your nose at our chinese junk. ill keep riding my cheap scooter and keep fixing it and loving every minute of it.
i like to fix what i have. i like to customize what i have. i like to add performance to my crappy cars and let them impress people. watching a lamborgini beat a BMW m3 isnt very impressive, but watching a honda civic beat an M3 is. you obviously seem like someone who would rather buy the lambo. ill stick to building my civic to spank it.
BUILT not bought!
six months to find someone to work on it? im sorry buddy but you weren't trying hard enough. there are mechanics out there all over the place. unless you are out in the middle of nowhere then im sure there was someone around to fix your scoot, you just didnt know where to look.
im guessing thats not your bergman with stars and such behind it. nice pic... it looks like... A CHINESE SCOOT! sure it might not be, but a scooter is a scooter is a freaking scooter.
o did you join just to bash on chinese scoots? seems like wasted time and effort to me. more waste of time than it would have been to simply fix your linhai...
I have seen the crappy quality of chinese parts in all sorts of places. I will be the FIRST to make fun of the chinese for their quality. but with them its not about quality. its about price. the sooner you realize that, the sooner you will get over your little "china is crappy" hissy fit.
as many have said, they have gotten plenty of trouble free miles from their chinese paperweights. ive gotten a few hundred on my chinese built- italian designed scoot. it cost more than most chinese scoots new, but i bought it used and got a good deal. its a bit better quality, but in the end its simply a pile of parts. what you get in the end depends on the quality of the parts, and the guy who built them.
more often than not, its the guy who built them. it is assumed that the person in china didnt do a very good job, so it is up to the AMERICAN here to fix those mistakes. it sounds like your dealer did not do this very well, if at all. your PDI includes all the bolts, including the ones you cant see or "didnt consider"
any mechanic will tell you your options are: good, cheap and fast. but you only can choose two. you want cheap and fast? it wont be good. want it good and fast? wont be cheap. you want it cheap and good? it wont be fast. china only does cheap and fast. most anyone over the age of 12 knows this. ever had the batteries that come in your chinese toy last longer than a couple days? china simply does what it always has done. pump out volumes of copied parts at a low price.
your bergman will break just like anything else. it will simply be more expensive to fix when it does. will it go longer without breaking? there is no way to tell, or prove that it will. go ride 50k on your scooter and then thumb your nose at our chinese junk. ill keep riding my cheap scooter and keep fixing it and loving every minute of it.
i like to fix what i have. i like to customize what i have. i like to add performance to my crappy cars and let them impress people. watching a lamborgini beat a BMW m3 isnt very impressive, but watching a honda civic beat an M3 is. you obviously seem like someone who would rather buy the lambo. ill stick to building my civic to spank it.
BUILT not bought!
six months to find someone to work on it? im sorry buddy but you weren't trying hard enough. there are mechanics out there all over the place. unless you are out in the middle of nowhere then im sure there was someone around to fix your scoot, you just didnt know where to look.
was motor was in your 65?
Hey. I don't expect to have to break down an entire vehicle and put it back together after purchase.
You are only being a dick here and really don't have any purpose in your message other to insult me for my opinion.
Sorry don't get the question as to what motor was in my 65.
Hi Burgman I em sorry you had such a bad experience with your Linhai, I know i love working and improving my little Chinese scooter, it definitely spends more time on the road than the garage.. I drive it every single day, the shortest trip is 5 miles, but most are in the 20 mile range or more, I had a lot of problems at first but after they were ironed out it's been a very good scooter.. All of us get lemons in our purchases from time to time, as long as your riding and happy that truly is what matters... Ride safe
Stuff happens. Still living and learning.
You're a gutsy rider to be riding every day in your part of the world. I usually return to the cage when the weather gets below 40 which isn't but a couple of months plus or minus in my part of the world. Hats off to you!
I use my scoot as if it were a car. Grocery shopping and general transportation. I also enjoy touring on it as well. I ride with a group that includes Harleys, GW's and just about everything on two wheels. A 500+ mile day is not unusual so I really want a scoot with a proven reliability record. I understand that there are many who enjoy tinkering and tweaking their rides. It's a grand thing and a thing I apparently have little aptitude for. Hence, the Linhai was probably a bad choice for me.
IMHO, it's all about the ride. So ride safely and with a smile.
Ohhhh I'm not gutsy, I don't think.. I grew up in the Midwest, winter is just one of the 4 seasons, each brings with it it's pleasures and pains, you just get used to dealing with each. I have always been more comfortable on two wheels than 4, don't have any explanation as to why, just have.
Right now in my current economic situation, a scooter is just a better choice, but to be fair, I'm merely justifying a reason to ride, I would do it anyway..
Joined: Jun 2008 Gender: Male Posts: 940 Location: Sedro-Woolley, WA
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #66 on Mar 2, 2011, 2:56pm »
As an owner of both a Chinese clone and a name brand scooter I feel for both sides here. There is a wealth of information on this site for the Chinese scooters. Chinese scooters cost less for a reason, and not all related to labor costs, warrenties from most places are worthless, alot of shops will not work on them, once the crate is dropped of in your driveway you are basically on your own. I was well aware of this when I made my purchase, crossed my fingers and hoped for the best. Had some teething issues when I got it, did some upgrades and was ok with it after the 1st month. Four months after I bought the 250B realized I needed something better than what I had for my commuting needs and something more reliable. I then made the jump to the current ride and the 250B was a backup ride. I got 5000 miles out of my 250B, before the engine fell apart, ran for almost a year and had about $3000 invested in it. Spent $5000 out the door for my current scooter, and have over 27000 miles on it and it still going like new. If I could go back in time would I have changed anything, ah....yup, would have spent the extra money and bought my current ride in the first place. My 250B was my gateway scooter and got the bug in me so it wasn't all bad. I think it is really up to chance to some extent with the Chinese bikes, some seem to run forever and others not so well. If you get lucky you can save alot of money.
You're a gutsy rider to be riding every day in your part of the world. I usually return to the cage when the weather gets below 40 which isn't but a couple of months plus or minus in my part of the world. Hats off to you!
I use my scoot as if it were a car. Grocery shopping and general transportation. I also enjoy touring on it as well. I ride with a group that includes Harleys, GW's and just about everything on two wheels. A 500+ mile day is not unusual so I really want a scoot with a proven reliability record. I understand that there are many who enjoy tinkering and tweaking their rides. It's a grand thing and a thing I apparently have little aptitude for. Hence, the Linhai was probably a bad choice for me.
IMHO, it's all about the ride. So ride safely and with a smile.
Ohhhh I'm not gutsy, I don't think.. I grew up in the Midwest, winter is just one of the 4 seasons, each brings with it it's pleasures and pains, you just get used to dealing with each. I have always been more comfortable on two wheels than 4, don't have any explanation as to why, just have.
Right now in my current economic situation, a scooter is just a better choice, but to be fair, I'm merely justifying a reason to ride, I would do it anyway..
Beautiful. Thats it singularity for us all who love to ride. Born in KC myself so there's a lot of understanding here.
As an owner of both a Chinese clone and a name brand scooter I feel for both sides here. There is a wealth of information on this site for the Chinese scooters. Chinese scooters cost less for a reason, and not all related to labor costs, warrenties from most places are worthless, alot of shops will not work on them, once the crate is dropped of in your driveway you are basically on your own. I was well aware of this when I made my purchase, crossed my fingers and hoped for the best. Had some teething issues when I got it, did some upgrades and was ok with it after the 1st month. Four months after I bought the 250B realized I needed something better than what I had for my commuting needs and something more reliable. I then made the jump to the current ride and the 250B was a backup ride. I got 5000 miles out of my 250B, before the engine fell apart, ran for almost a year and had about $3000 invested in it. Spent $5000 out the door for my current scooter, and have over 27000 miles on it and it still going like new. If I could go back in time would I have changed anything, ah....yup, would have spent the extra money and bought my current ride in the first place. My 250B was my gateway scooter and got the bug in me so it wasn't all bad. I think it is really up to chance to some extent with the Chinese bikes, some seem to run forever and others not so well. If you get lucky you can save alot of money.
Good post.
"If" and "if I got lucky."
Those are two things I gave up on in regard to Chinese scoots. There's also the communism thing that tainted my flavor.
How much am I willing to give up to drop a few grand to support a place that pays their workers subservient wages to save me a penny here? At this point it's not worth it,
Joined: Jun 2008 Gender: Male Posts: 940 Location: Sedro-Woolley, WA
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #70 on Mar 2, 2011, 4:11pm »
@ce, the problem with my 250B was out for a ride, engine noise got louder, looked back saw I had a cloud of black smoke behind me. Got it home and found out after taking the engine apart the piston rings had worn through, piston itself damaged,cylinder wall was damaged, found some cracked metal near the timing chain (a piece actually broke off). I needed to rebuild the engine and frankly the costs of money and valuable free time to do so, for a back-up scooter was not worth it. There is a thread I documented the process with pics, yada yada, The money I would spend in parts would offset any advantage to fixing it, same type bikes on Craigslist were selling for $600 at the time. I sold it as a project bike for $300. I am not bashing the Chinese bikes, this was my actual experience, and like I said was not all bad. Glad you can ride yours forever and wish you luck with it.
I see, if I love communism buy Chinese hu ?, That's just not a fair statement, you have no problem turning on your Chinese tv, grabbing your Chinese cell phone, dvd player, Mp3 player, Video games, and any number of Chinese products.
Before you make a statement like "if you love communism by Chinese" first look and make sure nothing you own and use is Chinese. Sorry telling it like it is
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #72 on Mar 2, 2011, 4:22pm »
I must also say I feel for both. I amnew to the scoot world, the first scoot i looked at was a 2007 jcl mp250a it was a nice bike and I was on my way to the dealer to buy it when my brother called and sed he had a friend selling a scoot and wanted me to look at it first. The scoot ended up being a Italian made 2005 Aprilia scarabeo 500 gt and he wanted 2500 for it wich was the same price as the jcl. I have road it non stop and am loveing it, but I may have been just as happy with jcl mp250a. I dont know all my previas exp was on full sized bikes. I mainly Bougth it for the mpg,my scarabeo gets about 65 to 70 mpg.
Joined: Oct 2008 Gender: Male Posts: 579 Location: New Mexico
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #73 on Mar 2, 2011, 4:26pm »
Whoa, Jim, that is harsh. I keep listening for engine noises, watching for smoke, smelling for unburnt fuel or electrical smoke, and sensing for weird vibrations, waiting for that long walk home.
But so far just minor hiccups from maladjustments that I was responsible for.
I suppose when one blows I'll try to put a 275 head on it, but til then, I'm floggin' it like it owes me money and don't wanna pay.
Gasoline is extremely flammable. Avoid fire in the work place
Joined: Sept 2010 Gender: Male Posts: 1,736 Location: Sin City
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #75 on Mar 2, 2011, 4:47pm »
No politics!!! TEE HEE I believe that buying a cheap scoot and then paying for repairs at some point will cost about the same as the upfront purchase price of buying a top 3 scoot. Either pay up front or, pay in the long/short run. If you learn or know how to problem solve that is where money is saved on the cheaper scoot.
If you don't like working on a vehicle, spend the money and buy one you don't have to. If you don't mind turning a wrench, go with something cheaper. Either way as long as your riding that's the important part!!! Be safe and ride
BTW- Bolts falling out or coming loose IS common on every vehicle that vibrates. Check your burgy out. Unless the dealer used locktite on all of them, There will be a loose bolt somewhere. I could be wrong but, that's my 2 cents!
I see, if I love communism buy Chinese hu ?, That's just not a fair statement, you have no problem turning on your Chinese tv, grabbing your Chinese cell phone, dvd player, Mp3 player, Video games, and any number of Chinese products.
Then after that lets discuss putting 40 or more dollars a week into Arabs hands that take that money, and fund those that want to do harm to Americans..
Before you make a statement like "if you love communism by Chinese" first look and make sure nothing you own and use is Chinese. Sorry telling it like it is
LOLZ.
FWIW, my TV is from Japan as is my Truck and Bike. I'm guessing most of my clothes have been manufactured by the Chinese or another communist nation
Bet it's pretty much the same for you.
Reality sucks.
Go buy a bag of frozen fish from Walmart. It comes from China
Economics have driven us to this in that we can't afford to buy products from people who make a living wage. Give it another 20-30 years and we'll be working for the same wages as they do in Somalia
No politics!!! TEE HEE I believe that buying a cheap scoot and then paying for repairs at some point will cost about the same as the upfront purchase price of buying a top 3 scoot. Either pay up front or, pay in the long/short run. If you learn or know how to problem solve that is where money is saved on the cheaper scoot.
If you don't like working on a vehicle, spend the money and buy one you don't have to. If you don't mind turning a wrench, go with something cheaper. Either way as long as your riding that's the important part!!! Be safe and ride
BTW- Bolts falling out or coming loose IS common on every vehicle that vibrates. Check your burgy out. Unless the dealer used locktite on all of them, There will be a loose bolt somewhere. I could be wrong but, that's my 2 cents!
Keep on Scootin On!!!!!
ok ok your right Bong, I was border line on that last post.
I see, if I love communism buy Chinese hu ?, That's just not a fair statement, you have no problem turning on your Chinese tv, grabbing your Chinese cell phone, dvd player, Mp3 player, Video games, and any number of Chinese products.
Then after that lets discuss putting 40 or more dollars a week into Arabs hands that take that money, and fund those that want to do harm to Americans..
Before you make a statement like "if you love communism by Chinese" first look and make sure nothing you own and use is Chinese. Sorry telling it like it is
LOLZ.
FWIW, my TV is from Japan as is my Truck and Bike. I'm guessing most of my clothes have been manufactured by the Chinese or another communist nation
Bet it's pretty much the same for you.
Reality sucks.
Go buy a bag of frozen fish from Walmart. It comes from China
Economics have driven us to this in that we can't afford to buy products from people who make a living wage. Give it another 20-30 years and we'll be working for the same wages as they do in Somalia
LOL well yea kinda, My car is a Pontiac, clothes are from the Philippines, as is my wallet, watch, belt, electric razor, and wife but yea your right about the wage.
No politics!!! TEE HEE I believe that buying a cheap scoot and then paying for repairs at some point will cost about the same as the upfront purchase price of buying a top 3 scoot. Either pay up front or, pay in the long/short run. If you learn or know how to problem solve that is where money is saved on the cheaper scoot.
If you don't like working on a vehicle, spend the money and buy one you don't have to. If you don't mind turning a wrench, go with something cheaper. Either way as long as your riding that's the important part!!! Be safe and ride
BTW- Bolts falling out or coming loose IS common on every vehicle that vibrates. Check your burgy out. Unless the dealer used locktite on all of them, There will be a loose bolt somewhere. I could be wrong but, that's my 2 cents!
Keep on Scootin On!!!!!
Bong, you have taken too many hits off your own pipe.
Maybe in the 50's and 60's but bolts no longer fall off a well made vehicle.
My Burgie gets a once over b4 every 500-1000 mile trek. I send it to the shop every 10K for a complete once over and whatever fluid changes are necessary. Haven't lost a bolt yet. So tell me. Where's your nearest Authorized Linhai service Center?
Joined: Feb 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 144 Location: Smithton, PA
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #80 on Mar 2, 2011, 6:08pm »
"well made vehicle" chinese scooters aren't well put together, and even if they were i've had a bolt or two fall out of my car. so well made or not, things go wrong.
Gasoline is extremely flammable. Avoid fire in the work place
Joined: Sept 2010 Gender: Male Posts: 1,736 Location: Sin City
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #81 on Mar 2, 2011, 7:21pm »
I have not owned a pipe since the 80s unless you count exhaust fumes Attacking my screen name seems somewhat petty IMO I've used the same name or variation of sense Windows 3.0.
Anyway, I think ya missed the point- IT'S NOT WHAT YOU RIDE, IT'S THAT YOU RIDE IMO
I am sorry you had a bad experience with your first purchase. People ordering cheap and not willing to do repairs is why cheap scooters have such a bad reputation.
So, the rings were bad, Sunright replaced them and honored the warranty. Why is it a paperweight now? You stated the first problems but never said why it wont run now.
My nearest sooter shop is about 3 miles away. I am happy to say I never have had to pay 50$ an hour for labor I can do myself. Yes they work on Cheap scoots and are authorized to work on many no brand names.
Joined: Jan 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 517 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #82 on Mar 2, 2011, 7:32pm »
I wonder what the reliability factor is on scooters used in the country they were built in. With the different riding habits and uses for a scooters in different countries I would like to see what if any difference there is.
I wonder what the reliability factor is on scooters used in the country they were built in. With the different riding habits and uses for a scooters in different countries I would like to see what if any difference there is.
I can say in the Philippines, scooters are quite numerous. and are driven all year around and in almost any weather, I never saw one broke down, except during typhoon Endoy, I was in Manila during that and the flooding aftermath. Afterward many vehicles were flooded, Including many scooters.
After the flood, they flushed out the water, changed the fluids, and drove them... I did see a one Chinese Motorcycle broken down awaiting parts. But only one as i recall, and i couldn't tell you the name of the cycle, I had never heard of it before. But it was a 125 cc i remember that.
Joined: Feb 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 194 Location: Greenville, SC
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #84 on Mar 2, 2011, 10:41pm »
whoa whoa guys haha... dont be so hard on Burgman, hes just pissed off he got a lemon, its understandable... Burgman I buy chinese scooters because im poor. But in all honesty I really started to love them after riding awhile.. I havent had much bad luck with em, both the chinese scooters I have owned were pretty damn solid... I ride 50 to 60 miles every single day on my JMStar 150... last week I rode 170 miles one day... I owned a Honda Elite once that pissed me off about as much as the chinese scooter your bought, but I dont think all hondas are sh!t haha... Their is lemons no matter what company you buy from..
Joined: Feb 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 194 Location: Greenville, SC
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #85 on Mar 2, 2011, 11:02pm »
To be perfectly honest, I absolutely love chinese scooters, But If I bought one brand new and it needed rings after 10 miles, I would be pretty damn pissed off too! And I agree with you burgman... You shouldnt be expected to tear down and rebuild a brand new 3000 dollar vehicle! But I wouldnt know... every scooter I have ever owned has been used... bought my 07 scoot for 500 bucks... nearly 2000 miles and running like its new.
Joined: Jan 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 1,398 Location: albuquerque
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #86 on Mar 2, 2011, 11:29pm »
whoa, hey there he or his mechanic said it needed rings after ten miles, and unverified claim, both sources i would consider biased, just internet talk as far as i am concerned.
do these claims have as much weight, since i am providing as much evidence as he did. 1. my 150 does 120 miles an hour and its not at max throttle 2. my scooter gets 100000 miles per gallon 3. the head of my dick hits the floor 4. i am the prince of indo china 5. Ce is a hot chick
Joined: May 2008 Gender: Male Posts: 48 Location: NorthEast Penna.
Re: Want a scooter that you don't have to spend al « Reply #87 on Mar 2, 2011, 11:45pm »
Guess what I started out with a 250 RoadQueen for 2 years then upgraded to a 07 650 Burgman Exec in 2009 The Burgman now is apart in my shed because of a water leak and also wire loom that has the electrical tape rubbed off it from the electric windshield motor. So count yourself lucky you haven't had any problems yet. I have more money in 2 oil changes on the Burgman than all the service I did on the RoadQueen in 2 years.
whoa, hey there he or his mechanic said it needed rings after ten miles, and unverified claim, both sources i would consider biased, just internet talk as far as i am concerned.
do these claims have as much weight, since i am providing as much evidence as he did. 1. my 150 does 120 miles an hour and its not at max throttle 2. my scooter gets 100000 miles per gallon 3. the head of my dick hits the floor 4. i am the prince of indo china 5. Ce is a hot chick
FWIW I'm not lying. Have no reason to.
1. My scoot sees the century mark in speed. 2. It only gets about 48 MPG 3. So does mine if I'm doing push-ups. 4. I'm not a prince or princess. 5. ??
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I believe that buying a cheap scoot and then paying for repairs at some point will cost about the same as the upfront purchase price of buying a top 3 scoot. Either pay up front or, pay in the long/short run. If you learn or know how to problem solve that is where money is saved on the cheaper scoot.
Attacking my screen name seems somewhat petty IMO I've used the same name or variation of sense Windows 3.0.
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